Today's Articles

• 12 Steps For Reformed Leftists

  Question:

  From Front Page Magazine’s Gail Penniman: The first step in any successful recovery program, such as Alcoholics Anonymous or Narcotics Anonymous, is to admit that there is a problem. For a leftist, then, stepping out of denial is the beginning of a journey toward clearer thinking and political sanity. I approach this topic with only a hint of humor, because I myself am a recovered leftist, with over 25 years of sobriety. Was I drunk on left-wing propaganda? Yes, and I became a user at a very tender age – as a child, in fact, in the home of my parents, who schooled me in the ways of communism and socialism. I believe this topic is extremely important at this juncture, because the far left is finding itself on the wrong side of history yet again and many of its members are lost at sea. I try to imagine myself, had I not awakened to the wrongness of my ideology, trying to survive both the re-election of George W. Bush and the successful Iraqi election. I would be beside myself with anger and disappointment. My index fingers would be in utter fatigue from non-stop pointing to assign blame. I might even threaten to move out of the country, as my brother and his wife are doing! I feel sad for leftists because they are stuck in their addiction. Strong wording? I think not, because I was there. Leftist ideology is a powerful and cunning potion, and if it gets into the mind at a young enough age, it can be extremely difficult to kick. Let me explain. I was brought up in the 1950s and ’60s in a suburb of New York City by two World War II veterans whose own parents were immigrants from Eastern Europe. My mother’s father took her to Communist Party meetings when she was a youngster, and my parents attended camps in upstate New York where young "reds" congregated, and where they met. As a child I read the works of Howard Fast and the periodical entitled The National Guardian. By the age of twelve, I was completely indoctrinated into the Communist mind-set and openly debated my seventh-grade social studies teacher on U.S. policy during the Cuban Missile Crisis. I was convinced of the evils of capitalism and believed that if the West would just not interfere, the Soviet Union would become a workers’ paradise (an old rant still mouthed today by many, including my mother and my son’s college history professor). My mother took me to various demonstrations before I left for college, at which time I involved myself in activist work against the Vietnam War, to my everlasting shame. There is no way for a "cradle" conservative to imagine the pain that a recovering leftist goes through when the veil is finally lifted. The second step in official 12-step programs is belief in a higher power, believing that your higher power can restore you. In recovering from leftist thinking, this step is not a requirement, but for me it was essential. In fact, during my 30th year I experienced a spiritual awakening that initiated many changes in values, which in turn brought me to my first conservative action step: voting for Ronald Reagan in 1980. To borrow Michael Medved’s term, I had become a "theo-con." Belief in a higher power is not always the starting place for a leftist in recovery. For some, it is intellectual honesty. Most recently, the Iraqi election came under attack from the far left in the United States and abroad. British Prime Minister Tony Blair rightly opined that anyone believing in liberty and self-rule could not possibly oppose the election. But leftists were able to do so because of intellectual dishonesty and their belief in ends-justify-the-means politics. Since a successful election in Iraq means a victory for the hated Bush and a vindication of the military, the left must oppose it. But in opposing Iraqi self-rule, the left must abandon one of its core positions: freedom from tyranny for the oppressed. Those on the left cannot have it both ways, and in continually trying to do so, they expose themselves as the intellectually bankrupt people they really are. Leftists ready to recover must use what recovering alcoholics call rigorous honesty to rid themselves of the habit of "dual think." The fourth step in AA is a fearless moral inventory, and the folks on the far left who dare to take a fearless intellectual inventory will realize that their dual-think positions are untenable. It can be frightening for a person to walk away from a lifetime of strongly held beliefs and into new ways of thinking. Family and close friends may misunderstand and even reject you. This happens. It is similar in many respects to what happens to individuals who leave a cult; they find themselves ostracized, ridiculed or marginalized. It is best not to engage in too many political discussions until you are sure of what you now stand for, how to defend your new positions, and who you can trust. Reading magazine articles and books to develop a knowledge base is essential. I was in recovery for over 20 years when I read David Horowitz’s "Radical Son," which documents his life journey from "red diaper baby" to leftist activist to highly regarded conservative scholar. It was not until I read this book that I realized that I was not alone in my "conversion" and how deeply angry I was at having been so brainwashed as a child. I now regard the politicizing of young children as a form of child abuse. This realization enabled me to deal with my anger and to begin to grow beyond it. The 12th step in the AA program is to carry the message of recovery to others. It is a marvelous step because in doing so, you cement the fact that you have finally arrived at some place of clarity and are strong enough to spread the message. To all those whose beliefs have been shaken by recent events, to all those whose ideological houses have been built on sand: Take heart, because there is hope if you will bravely admit that you were in the wrong and move to the right. As Dennis Prager says, it is okay to be wrong; it is not okay to stay that way.

  Response:

  Thanks, but some folks need to be bored to death just before bedtime to help konk them out. 7:39AM is way too early to be posting sappy insipid lemming drone monologue for dayworkers. Snore….

  From Front Page Magazine’s Gail Penniman: The first step in any successful recovery

  program, such as Alcoholics Anonymous or Narcotics Anonymous, is to admit

  that there is a problem. For a leftist, then, stepping out of denial is the

  beginning of a journey toward clearer thinking and political sanity. I

  approach this topic with only a hint of humor, because I myself am a recovered

  leftist, with over 25 years of sobriety. Was I drunk on left-wing

  propaganda? Yes, and I became a user at a very tender age – as a child, in fact, in

  the home of my parents, who schooled me in the ways of communism and socialism. I believe this topic is extremely important at

  this juncture, because the far left is finding itself on the wrong side of

  history yet again and many of its members are lost at sea. I try to imagine

  myself, had I not awakened to the wrongness of my ideology, trying to

  survive both the re-election of George W. Bush and the successful Iraqi

  election. I would be beside myself with anger and disappointment. My index fingers

  would be in utter fatigue from non-stop pointing to assign blame. I might

  even threaten to move out of the country, as my brother and his wife are doing! I feel sad for leftists because they are stuck

  in their addiction. Strong wording? I think not, because I was there.

  Leftist ideology is a powerful and cunning potion, and if it gets into the mind

  at a young enough age, it can be extremely difficult to kick. Let me explain. I was brought up in the 1950s and ’60s in a

  suburb of New York City by two World War II veterans whose own parents were

  immigrants from Eastern Europe. My mother’s father took her to Communist Party

  meetings when she was a youngster, and my parents attended camps in

  upstate New York where young "reds" congregated, and where they met. As a

  child I read the works of Howard Fast and the periodical entitled The

  National Guardian. By the age of twelve, I was completely indoctrinated into the

  Communist mind-set and openly debated my seventh-grade social studies

  teacher on U.S. policy during the Cuban Missile Crisis. I was convinced of the evils of capitalism and

  believed that if the West would just not interfere, the Soviet Union would

  become a workers’ paradise (an old rant still mouthed today by many,

  including my mother and my son’s college history professor). My mother took me to

  various demonstrations before I left for college, at which time I

  involved myself in activist work against the Vietnam War, to my everlasting shame. There is no way for a "cradle" conservative to

  imagine the pain that a recovering leftist goes through when the veil is

  finally lifted. The second step in official 12-step programs is belief in a

  higher power, believing that your higher power can restore you. In

  recovering from leftist thinking, this step is not a requirement, but for me it

  was essential. In fact, during my 30th year I experienced a spiritual awakening

  that initiated many changes in values, which in turn brought me to my first

  conservative action step: voting for Ronald Reagan in 1980. To borrow

  Michael Medved’s term, I had become a "theo-con." Belief in a higher power is not always the

  starting place for a leftist in recovery. For some, it is intellectual honesty.

  Most recently, the Iraqi election came under attack from the far left in

  the United States and abroad. British Prime Minister Tony Blair

  rightly opined that anyone believing in liberty and self-rule could not

  possibly oppose the election. But leftists were able to do so because of

  intellectual dishonesty and their belief in ends-justify-the-means politics. Since

  a successful election in Iraq means a victory for the hated Bush and a

  vindication of the military, the left must oppose it. But in opposing Iraqi self-rule, the left must

  abandon one of its core positions: freedom from tyranny for the

  oppressed. Those on the left cannot have it both ways, and in continually trying to do so, they expose themselves as the intellectually bankrupt people

  they really are. Leftists ready to recover must use what recovering

  alcoholics call rigorous honesty to rid themselves of the habit of "dual think."

  The fourth step in AA is a fearless moral inventory, and the folks on the

  far left who dare to take a fearless intellectual inventory will realize

  that their dual-think positions are untenable. It can be frightening for a person to walk away

  from a lifetime of strongly held beliefs and into new ways of thinking.

  Family and close friends may misunderstand and even reject you. This happens.

  It is similar in many respects to what happens to individuals who

  leave a cult; they find themselves ostracized, ridiculed or

  marginalized. It is best not to engage in too many political discussions until you are

  sure of what you now stand for, how to defend your new positions, and who

  you can trust. Reading magazine articles and books to develop a

  knowledge base is essential. I was in recovery for over 20 years when I read

  David Horowitz’s "Radical Son," which documents his life journey from "red

  diaper baby" to leftist activist to highly regarded conservative

  scholar. It was not until I read this book that I realized that I was not alone

  in my "conversion" and how deeply angry I was at having been so brainwashed

  as a child. I now regard the politicizing of young children as a form of child abuse. This realization enabled me to deal with my anger and

  to begin to grow beyond it. The 12th step in the AA program is to carry the

  message of recovery to others. It is a marvelous step because in doing

  so, you cement the fact that you have finally arrived at some place of

  clarity and are strong enough to spread the message. To all those whose beliefs

  have been shaken by recent events, to all those whose ideological houses

  have been built on sand: Take heart, because there is hope if you will bravely

  admit that you were in the wrong and move to the right. As Dennis Prager

  says, it is okay to be wrong; – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – it is not okay to stay that way.

  Response:

  <shit ROFLMAO! What a load of hooey. Bob

  Response:

      amazing what .$ s/left/right/g  yields: The first step in any successful recovery program, such as Alcoholics Anonymous or Narcotics Anonymous, is to admit that there is a problem. For a rightist, then, stepping out of denial is the beginning of a journey toward clearer thinking and political sanity. I approach this topic with only a hint of humor, because I myself am a recovered rightist, with over 25 years of sobriety. Was I drunk on right-wing propaganda? Yes, and I became a user at a very tender age – as a child, in fact, in the home of my parents, who schooled me in the ways of communism and socialism. I believe this topic is extremely important at this juncture, because the far right is finding itself on the wrong side of history yet again and many of its members are lost at sea. I try to imagine myself, had I not awakened to the wrongness of my ideology, trying to survive both the re-election of George W. Bush and the successful Iraqi election. I would be beside myself with anger and disappointment. My index fingers would be in utter fatigue from non-stop pointing to assign blame. I might even threaten to move out of the country, as my brother and his wife are doing! I feel sad for rightists because they are stuck in their addiction. Strong wording? I think not, because I was there. blah blah blah …..

  Response:

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  

• Its me

  Question:

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Alan, I am so pleased that you posted to my thread.  I am glad that you and I can now bury the past and I hope to contribute to this group. You were right about me getting on with it, at the time I did not see that as a positive comment.  I did feel that I needed answers and I had nothing to go on apart from this group and a crap Psychologist that really was telling me that my lack of eye contact was just due to being shy. But at the end of the day you can see the best Psychiatrists in the world, but if you are not ready to help yourself then you will still be at square one. My problem was the fact that I had a lot of anger in me.  I also felt very bitter cause I was so different from everyone else.  I had no answers and no so called professionals were giving me any.  The thing that was so stupid is that people were reaching out to me on this group and I was too stupid to realise.  Celeste and others hit the nail on the head when they mentioned Autism. Autism to me at the time was Forest Gump or Rain Man.  So I felt that was simply having a go and calling me Retarded, rather then trying to help. In fact looking back through the posts on here and how I was I am amazed anyone tried at all.  After all it would have been easy to just dump me.  But you tried to help me to understand where I was going wrong. I was lucky enough to meet someone who cared for me enough to see past the anger that I was feeling and understood I had problems.  I was also lucky enough to finally find a Psychiatrist that would take my condition seriously. I would like to thank everyone that welcomed me back here.  I mean I was not expecting a positive responce after reading my prose from the past. Take care all Steve http://clix.to/chemer Hi Steve … As you may recall – there is no abandonment in the fellowship. This is a very straight forward and honest inventory taking, most impressive and you have what ever forgiveness you need from me … its really really okey over here. I recall you and also you might have remember me making some biting comments to you at that time as well such as stop sniveling about your life if you are not going to do anything about it and work some recovery … which it seems you have done … and a rather magnificent job you seemed to have done with it. Recently I healed up my attachment disorder over this past christmas … lots of tears and snot … but it feels great to be in me now … still have tears and snot coming out – but I am happy about it for some reason. it makes me giggle while I write this. welcome back to the ng – glad you are doing so well and I wish you best of the new year. Alan B. Mac Farlane aka sumbuddie duex amor HI all, This is Chemer.  Those of you who have been in this group at least 3 years will remember me as a person who started a lot of flame wars and bad feeling in this group. I want to say that I am now DXd with Aspergers Syndrome and things have become very clear as to why I have felt different all my life . Aspergers is based on the Autistic Spectrum but Higher Functioning. Many people reached out to me and said that they felt I was Autistic, but I felt they were simply calling me a retard.  I took it not as advise but as a flame and thus started ranting more and more. I thankfully have grown up since those old days.  I am now 33 and Married to a lovley Wife called Sarah.  She too was abused as a Child and understands all that I went through.  We both chuckled at the original posts by me and I think I was verging on the Scitzo. I would like to appologise to people in this group that knew the old me.  I have come a long way in my recovery.  I even started a group called Aspergers World 3.  This was set up to help people with the same Condition as myself. I would like to post a special Appology to Celeste57 and Silverleaf who got a lot of my anger way back in 1998. Both tried to help me where as others could have blocked me.  Both tried to tell me that I could have some kind of Autism.  I did not beleive them and had I of just looked into it things may have been clearer in my mind. Anyway take care call, Steve http://clix.to/chemer

  well … now you have an idea of what recovery might look like … huh ? alan

  Response:

  i remember you well, Chemer.  i was sad to see you go, because you seemed  to leave on a high note, saying conciliatory words and already having some insight into what was going on.  it was sad that we could not enjoy your company now that you were not mad at us any longer.

  Hi Azure, I think I was just mad at myself.  I needed someone to listen to me and the more people found me obnoxious on this group the more I hit out.  I was 27 but going on 10-11 in my mentality.  Instead of doing something to help my current circumstances I chose to wine about the past and not look to the future.  Rejecting what others said and thinking they were just being nasty and finally being alienated from the group. One of the main things that effects Aspergers is the developmental delay in our social outlook.  In my case I was always at least 10 years younger socially than I should have been.  So although at 27 I was like a teen or even less. At 33 I can now look upon the old me as a learning curb. Hopefully I have learned enough to never become that person again. Having Aspergers can make us very literal and we do not seem to see when people are trying to have a laugh with us.  Yes we can also expect a lot from our friends and even push them away.  Some Aspies find it hard to keep or make friends full stop. If someone told me to drop dead in the old days I would feel that they really meant it.  Also if someone said they would kill me.  Even my own Mother who said I am going to kill you when I catch you you Buger.  I really felt my life was in danger. Take care, Steve

  Response:

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – One of the hardest things about the way it affects my personal relationships is how bloody literal I am.  I don’t buy into it when someone says yeah, I know I said that but I *meant* this.  I get stuck there on ‘you *said* this, you need to address what you said.  It gets very hard, sometimes, to have an argument with me. And I remember every single word spoken so my husband is often painted into a corner by what he said in anger  :P EXACTLY. i mean … sure, i understand simile and metaphor, and exaggeration for comic effect, but sometimes white lies and polite misstatements zoom right over my head.

  I can do metaphors and similes with the best of them.  But if someone says x, and meant xy, all I will focus on is x.  There has to be some kind of mutual understanding of when x means xy or goddamnit, x is x.  It made algebra impossible for me, because when they say  x + y = z, fuck a duck, those numbers could be *anything*,  they can say they are *anything they want.  Makes no sense.

  Response:

  One of the hardest things about the way it affects my personal relationships is how bloody literal I am.  I don’t buy into it when someone says yeah, I know I said that but I *meant* this.  I get stuck there on ‘you *said* this, you need to address what you said.  It gets very hard, sometimes, to have an argument with me. And I remember every single word spoken so my husband is often painted into a corner by what he said in anger  :P

  EXACTLY. i mean … sure, i understand simile and metaphor, and exaggeration for comic effect, but sometimes white lies and polite misstatements zoom right over my head. azure

  Response:

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i remember you well, Chemer.  i was sad to see you go, because you seemed to leave on a high note, saying conciliatory words and already having some insight into what was going on.  it was sad that we could not enjoy your company now that you were not mad at us any longer. yeah, some of us know about Aspergers, having it in our own families and some even in our own selves.  i, myself, have a touch of it.  isn’t it wonderful to find out the root cause of so many disjointed things that have gone on? i have found that one of the things about Aspergers is that it makes us a bit hard on our friends.  i tend to be a bit hard on mine, at times.  i admire the strides you are making toward taking responsibility for your part in difficulties.

  One of the hardest things about the way it affects my personal relationships is how bloody literal I am.  I don’t buy into it when someone says yeah, I know I said that but I *meant* this.  I get stuck there on ‘you *said* this, you need to address what you said.  It gets very hard, sometimes, to have an argument with me.  And I remember every single word spoken so my husband is often painted into a corner by what he said in anger  :P – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i’m glad you posted again. azure

  Response:

  i remember you well, Chemer.  i was sad to see you go, because you seemed to leave on a high note, saying conciliatory words and already having some insight into what was going on.  it was sad that we could not enjoy your company now that you were not mad at us any longer. yeah, some of us know about Aspergers, having it in our own families and some even in our own selves.  i, myself, have a touch of it.  isn’t it wonderful to find out the root cause of so many disjointed things that have gone on? i have found that one of the things about Aspergers is that it makes us a bit hard on our friends.  i tend to be a bit hard on mine, at times.  i admire the strides you are making toward taking responsibility for your part in difficulties. i’m glad you posted again. azure

  Response:

  Newsgroups: alt.abuse.recovery NNTP-Posting-Host: 82.37.72.79 Hi Alan, I am so pleased that you posted to my thread.  I am glad that you and I can now bury the past and I hope to contribute to this group. You were right about me getting on with it, at the time I did not see that as a positive comment.  I did feel that I needed answers and I had nothing to go on apart from this group and a crap Psychologist that really was telling me that my lack of eye contact was just due to being shy. But at the end of the day you can see the best Psychiatrists in the world, but if you are not ready to help yourself then you will still be at square one. My problem was the fact that I had a lot of anger in me.  I also felt very bitter cause I was so different from everyone else.  I had no answers and no so called professionals were giving me any.  The thing that was so stupid is that people were reaching out to me on this group and I was too stupid to realise.  Celeste and others hit the nail on the head when they mentioned Autism. Autism to me at the time was Forest Gump or Rain Man.  So I felt that was simply having a go and calling me Retarded, rather then trying to help. In fact looking back through the posts on here and how I was I am amazed anyone tried at all.  After all it would have been easy to just dump me.  But you tried to help me to understand where I was going wrong. I was lucky enough to meet someone who cared for me enough to see past the anger that I was feeling and understood I had problems.  I was also lucky enough to finally find a Psychiatrist that would take my condition seriously. I would like to thank everyone that welcomed me back here.  I mean I was not expecting a positive responce after reading my prose from the past. Take care all Steve

  Response:

  hey – hate nicks just noting the fact pattern, Steve was talking to me and not to you … but you want to chime in about him and his recovery issues around autism, child abuse, anger, rage even since that is historical just like grief is historical to sadness being present. there is ptsd issues going on here … and dispite you being maddening about something that you have little grounding and history on … Steve is not talking down the autism that is in your family. a better diet, detoxing the body and some 5 element traditional accupuncture would help more then just living with it … not much autism going on 50 years ago – same for cancer and lots of other white mans diseases … adapt to it – Bush says you will love his future. you dont care about him killing your children for lies about Iraq. sumbuddie on da watchtower AM: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You know, two things stirke me here: 1.  I didn’t know you before, but it’s positively maddening how well you can spout the psychobabble.  I never trust it when someone starts talking like a Stepford Survivor. 2,  I have Asperger’s.  Two of my kids have Asperger’s.  I have been a real bitch and I do not, in any way, attribute that to being on the ‘autistic scale’.  I am a bitch because I choose to be one.  It had nothing at all to do with unearthed dx’s and everything to do with a lack of self control. Hi Alan, I am so pleased that you posted to my thread.  I am glad that you and I can now bury the past and I hope to contribute to this group. You were right about me getting on with it, at the time I did not see that as a positive comment.  I did feel that I needed answers and I had nothing to go on apart from this group and a crap Psychologist that really was telling me that my lack of eye contact was just due to being shy. But at the end of the day you can see the best Psychiatrists in the world, but if you are not ready to help yourself then you will still be at square one. My problem was the fact that I had a lot of anger in me.  I also felt very bitter cause I was so different from everyone else.  I had no answers and no so called professionals were giving me any.  The thing that was so stupid is that people were reaching out to me on this group and I was too stupid to realise.  Celeste and others hit the nail on the head when they mentioned Autism. Autism to me at the time was Forest Gump or Rain Man.  So I felt that was simply having a go and calling me Retarded, rather then trying to help. In fact looking back through the posts on here and how I was I am amazed anyone tried at all.  After all it would have been easy to just dump me.  But you tried to help me to understand where I was going wrong. I was lucky enough to meet someone who cared for me enough to see past the anger that I was feeling and understood I had problems.  I was also lucky enough to finally find a Psychiatrist that would take my condition seriously. I would like to thank everyone that welcomed me back here.  I mean I was not expecting a positive responce after reading my prose from the past. Take care all Steve http://clix.to/chemer Hi Steve … As you may recall – there is no abandonment in the fellowship. This is a very straight forward and honest inventory taking, most impressive and you have what ever forgiveness you need from me … its really really okey over here. I recall you and also you might have remember me making some biting comments to you at that time as well such as stop sniveling about your life if you are not going to do anything about it and work some recovery … which it seems you have done … and a rather magnificent job you seemed to have done with it. Recently I healed up my attachment disorder over this past christmas … lots of tears and snot … but it feels great to be in me now … still have tears and snot coming out – but I am happy about it for some reason. it makes me giggle while I write this. welcome back to the ng – glad you are doing so well and I wish you best of the new year. Alan B. Mac Farlane aka sumbuddie duex amor Chemer27now33 at HI all, This is Chemer.  Those of you who have been in this group at least 3 years will remember me as a person who started a lot of flame wars and bad feeling in this group. I want to say that I am now DXd with Aspergers Syndrome and things have become very clear as to why I have felt different all my life . Aspergers is based on the Autistic Spectrum but Higher Functioning. Many people reached out to me and said that they felt I was Autistic, but I felt they were simply calling me a retard.  I took it not as advise but as a flame and thus started ranting more and more. I thankfully have grown up since those old days.  I am now 33 and Married to a lovley Wife called Sarah.  She too was abused as a Child and understands all that I went through.  We both chuckled at the original posts by me and I think I was verging on the Scitzo. I would like to appologise to people in this group that knew the old me.  I have come a long way in my recovery.  I even started a group called Aspergers World 3.  This was set up to help people with the same Condition as myself. I would like to post a special Appology to Celeste57 and Silverleaf who got a lot of my anger way back in 1998. Both tried to help me where as others could have blocked me.  Both tried to tell me that I could have some kind of Autism.  I did not beleive them and had I of just looked into it things may have been clearer in my mind. Anyway take care call, Steve http://clix.to/chemer

  Response:

  You know, two things stirke me here: 1.  I didn’t know you before, but it’s positively maddening how well you can spout the psychobabble.  I never trust it when someone starts talking like a Stepford Survivor. 2,  I have Asperger’s.  Two of my kids have Asperger’s.  I have been a real bitch and I do not, in any way, attribute that to being on the ‘autistic scale’.  I am a bitch because I choose to be one.  It had nothing at all to do with unearthed dx’s and everything to do with a lack of self control.

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Alan, I am so pleased that you posted to my thread.  I am glad that you and I can now bury the past and I hope to contribute to this group. You were right about me getting on with it, at the time I did not see that as a positive comment.  I did feel that I needed answers and I had nothing to go on apart from this group and a crap Psychologist that really was telling me that my lack of eye contact was just due to being shy. But at the end of the day you can see the best Psychiatrists in the world, but if you are not ready to help yourself then you will still be at square one. My problem was the fact that I had a lot of anger in me.  I also felt very bitter cause I was so different from everyone else.  I had no answers and no so called professionals were giving me any.  The thing that was so stupid is that people were reaching out to me on this group and I was too stupid to realise.  Celeste and others hit the nail on the head when they mentioned Autism. Autism to me at the time was Forest Gump or Rain Man.  So I felt that was simply having a go and calling me Retarded, rather then trying to help. In fact looking back through the posts on here and how I was I am amazed anyone tried at all.  After all it would have been easy to just dump me.  But you tried to help me to understand where I was going wrong. I was lucky enough to meet someone who cared for me enough to see past the anger that I was feeling and understood I had problems.  I was also lucky enough to finally find a Psychiatrist that would take my condition seriously. I would like to thank everyone that welcomed me back here.  I mean I was not expecting a positive responce after reading my prose from the past. Take care all Steve http://clix.to/chemer Hi Steve … As you may recall – there is no abandonment in the fellowship. This is a very straight forward and honest inventory taking, most impressive and you have what ever forgiveness you need from me … its really really okey over here. I recall you and also you might have remember me making some biting comments to you at that time as well such as stop sniveling about your life if you are not going to do anything about it and work some recovery … which it seems you have done … and a rather magnificent job you seemed to have done with it. Recently I healed up my attachment disorder over this past christmas … lots of tears and snot … but it feels great to be in me now … still have tears and snot coming out – but I am happy about it for some reason. it makes me giggle while I write this. welcome back to the ng – glad you are doing so well and I wish you best of the new year. Alan B. Mac Farlane aka sumbuddie duex amor Chemer27now33 at HI all, This is Chemer.  Those of you who have been in this group at least 3 years will remember me as a person who started a lot of flame wars and bad feeling in this group. I want to say that I am now DXd with Aspergers Syndrome and things have become very clear as to why I have felt different all my life . Aspergers is based on the Autistic Spectrum but Higher Functioning. Many people reached out to me and said that they felt I was Autistic, but I felt they were simply calling me a retard.  I took it not as advise but as a flame and thus started ranting more and more. I thankfully have grown up since those old days.  I am now 33 and Married to a lovley Wife called Sarah.  She too was abused as a Child and understands all that I went through.  We both chuckled at the original posts by me and I think I was verging on the Scitzo. I would like to appologise to people in this group that knew the old me.  I have come a long way in my recovery.  I even started a group called Aspergers World 3.  This was set up to help people with the same Condition as myself. I would like to post a special Appology to Celeste57 and Silverleaf who got a lot of my anger way back in 1998. Both tried to help me where as others could have blocked me.  Both tried to tell me that I could have some kind of Autism.  I did not beleive them and had I of just looked into it things may have been clearer in my mind. Anyway take care call, Steve http://clix.to/chemer

  Response:

  Hi Alan, I am so pleased that you posted to my thread.  I am glad that you and I can now bury the past and I hope to contribute to this group. You were right about me getting on with it, at the time I did not see that as a positive comment.  I did feel that I needed answers and I had nothing to go on apart from this group and a crap Psychologist that really was telling me that my lack of eye contact was just due to being shy. But at the end of the day you can see the best Psychiatrists in the world, but if you are not ready to help yourself then you will still be at square one. My problem was the fact that I had a lot of anger in me.  I also felt very bitter cause I was so different from everyone else.  I had no answers and no so called professionals were giving me any.  The thing that was so stupid is that people were reaching out to me on this group and I was too stupid to realise.  Celeste and others hit the nail on the head when they mentioned Autism. Autism to me at the time was Forest Gump or Rain Man.  So I felt that was simply having a go and calling me Retarded, rather then trying to help. In fact looking back through the posts on here and how I was I am amazed anyone tried at all.  After all it would have been easy to just dump me.  But you tried to help me to understand where I was going wrong. I was lucky enough to meet someone who cared for me enough to see past the anger that I was feeling and understood I had problems.  I was also lucky enough to finally find a Psychiatrist that would take my condition seriously. I would like to thank everyone that welcomed me back here.  I mean I was not expecting a positive responce after reading my prose from the past. Take care all Steve http://clix.to/chemer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Steve … As you may recall – there is no abandonment in the fellowship. This is a very straight forward and honest inventory taking, most impressive and you have what ever forgiveness you need from me … its really really okey over here. I recall you and also you might have remember me making some biting comments to you at that time as well such as stop sniveling about your life if you are not going to do anything about it and work some recovery … which it seems you have done … and a rather magnificent job you seemed to have done with it. Recently I healed up my attachment disorder over this past christmas … lots of tears and snot … but it feels great to be in me now … still have tears and snot coming out – but I am happy about it for some reason. it makes me giggle while I write this. welcome back to the ng – glad you are doing so well and I wish you best of the new year. Alan B. Mac Farlane aka sumbuddie duex amor HI all, This is Chemer.  Those of you who have been in this group at least 3 years will remember me as a person who started a lot of flame wars and bad feeling in this group. I want to say that I am now DXd with Aspergers Syndrome and things have become very clear as to why I have felt different all my life . Aspergers is based on the Autistic Spectrum but Higher Functioning. Many people reached out to me and said that they felt I was Autistic, but I felt they were simply calling me a retard.  I took it not as advise but as a flame and thus started ranting more and more. I thankfully have grown up since those old days.  I am now 33 and Married to a lovley Wife called Sarah.  She too was abused as a Child and understands all that I went through.  We both chuckled at the original posts by me and I think I was verging on the Scitzo. I would like to appologise to people in this group that knew the old me.  I have come a long way in my recovery.  I even started a group called Aspergers World 3.  This was set up to help people with the same Condition as myself. I would like to post a special Appology to Celeste57 and Silverleaf who got a lot of my anger way back in 1998. Both tried to help me where as others could have blocked me.  Both tried to tell me that I could have some kind of Autism.  I did not beleive them and had I of just looked into it things may have been clearer in my mind. Anyway take care call, Steve http://clix.to/chemer

  Response:

  Hello Chemer,

  HI Jeeco, It is good to hear that things are going well for you! Yes, you did manage to singe a few feathers around here

  I know and will never excuse my actions.  I really was very immature at 27 and really was hitting out at the pain I had in the past.  But I had no right to cause other people suffering and pain simply cause I was hurting. Neither Celeste nor Silverleaf post here anymore.  I’ve seen Celeste’s nick on the rolls of another ng but alas, Silverleaf seems to have just disappeared.

  I would be interested to explain the way I was to Celeste and hopefully she will realise that I acted out of frustration and didn’t really single her out.  I was looking for some kind of punching bag at the time and for a time became the abuser   Perhaps someone else has some information on her. She was truly a valued member on this ng imo.

  She certainly was right about my Aspergers.  ALthough she did say I was on the Autisic Spectrum.  But at the time I saw that as an attack on me. Again, I’m glad you were able to get a diagnosis that made things clearer for you and that you were able to move forward.  Also, congratulations on your marriage!

  Thanks you can see Sarah and I at http://www.geocities.com/sarsee21 Take care. Steve

  Response:

  HI all, This is Chemer.  Those of you who have been in this group at least 3 years will remember me as a person who started a lot of flame wars and bad feeling in this group. I want to say that I am now DXd with Aspergers Syndrome and things have become very clear as to why I have felt different all my life . Aspergers is based on the Autistic Spectrum but Higher Functioning. Many people reached out to me and said that they felt I was Autistic, but I felt they were simply calling me a retard.  I took it not as advise but as a flame and thus started ranting more and more. I thankfully have grown up since those old days.  I am now 33 and Married to a lovley Wife called Sarah.  She too was abused as a Child and understands all that I went through.  We both chuckled at the original posts by me and I think I was verging on the Scitzo. I would like to appologise to people in this group that knew the old me.  I have come a long way in my recovery.  I even started a group called Aspergers World 3.  This was set up to help people with the same Condition as myself. I would like to post a special Appology to Celeste57 and Silverleaf who got a lot of my anger way back in 1998. Both tried to help me where as others could have blocked me.  Both tried to tell me that I could have some kind of Autism.  I did not beleive them and had I of just looked into it things may have been clearer in my mind. Anyway take care call, Steve http://clix.to/chemer

  Response:

  Hello Chemer, It is good to hear that things are going well for you! Yes, you did manage to singe a few feathers around here Neither Celeste nor Silverleaf post here anymore.  I’ve seen Celeste’s nick on the rolls of another ng but alas, Silverleaf seems to have just disappeared.  Perhaps someone else has some information on her. She was truly a valued member on this ng imo. Again, I’m glad you were able to get a diagnosis that made things clearer for you and that you were able to move forward.  Also, congratulations on your marriage! jeeco

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – HI all, This is Chemer.  Those of you who have been in this group at least 3 years will remember me as a person who started a lot of flame wars and bad feeling in this group. I want to say that I am now DXd with Aspergers Syndrome and things have become very clear as to why I have felt different all my life . Aspergers is based on the Autistic Spectrum but Higher Functioning. Many people reached out to me and said that they felt I was Autistic, but I felt they were simply calling me a retard.  I took it not as advise but as a flame and thus started ranting more and more. I thankfully have grown up since those old days.  I am now 33 and Married to a lovley Wife called Sarah.  She too was abused as a Child and understands all that I went through.  We both chuckled at the original posts by me and I think I was verging on the Scitzo. I would like to appologise to people in this group that knew the old me.  I have come a long way in my recovery.  I even started a group called Aspergers World 3.  This was set up to help people with the same Condition as myself. I would like to post a special Appology to Celeste57 and Silverleaf who got a lot of my anger way back in 1998. Both tried to help me where as others could have blocked me.  Both tried to tell me that I could have some kind of Autism.  I did not beleive them and had I of just looked into it things may have been clearer in my mind. Anyway take care call, Steve http://clix.to/chemer

  – For more information about this NNTP posting service, contact: If you want an anonymous account, visit our sign-up page: https://asarian-host.net/cgi-bin/signup.cgi

  Response:

  Hi Steve … As you may recall – there is no abandonment in the fellowship. This is a very straight forward and honest inventory taking, most impressive and you have what ever forgiveness you need from me … its really really okey over here. I recall you and also you might have remember me making some biting comments to you at that time as well such as stop sniveling about your life if you are not going to do anything about it and work some recovery … which it seems you have done … and a rather magnificent job you seemed to have done with it. Recently I healed up my attachment disorder over this past christmas … lots of tears and snot … but it feels great to be in me now … still have tears and snot coming out – but I am happy about it for some reason. it makes me giggle while I write this. welcome back to the ng – glad you are doing so well and I wish you best of the new year. Alan B. Mac Farlane aka sumbuddie duex amor – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – HI all, This is Chemer.  Those of you who have been in this group at least 3 years will remember me as a person who started a lot of flame wars and bad feeling in this group. I want to say that I am now DXd with Aspergers Syndrome and things have become very clear as to why I have felt different all my life . Aspergers is based on the Autistic Spectrum but Higher Functioning. Many people reached out to me and said that they felt I was Autistic, but I felt they were simply calling me a retard.  I took it not as advise but as a flame and thus started ranting more and more. I thankfully have grown up since those old days.  I am now 33 and Married to a lovley Wife called Sarah.  She too was abused as a Child and understands all that I went through.  We both chuckled at the original posts by me and I think I was verging on the Scitzo. I would like to appologise to people in this group that knew the old me.  I have come a long way in my recovery.  I even started a group called Aspergers World 3.  This was set up to help people with the same Condition as myself. I would like to post a special Appology to Celeste57 and Silverleaf who got a lot of my anger way back in 1998. Both tried to help me where as others could have blocked me.  Both tried to tell me that I could have some kind of Autism.  I did not beleive them and had I of just looked into it things may have been clearer in my mind. Anyway take care call, Steve http://clix.to/chemer

  Response:

  Congratulations Steve. I’m glad you have found happiness and peace in your life.  It’s so nice to see you have turned around the pain and are using it for others who have Aspergers. Best, Panther

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – HI all, This is Chemer.  Those of you who have been in this group at least 3 years will remember me as a person who started a lot of flame wars and bad feeling in this group. I want to say that I am now DXd with Aspergers Syndrome and things have become very clear as to why I have felt different all my life . Aspergers is based on the Autistic Spectrum but Higher Functioning. Many people reached out to me and said that they felt I was Autistic, but I felt they were simply calling me a retard.  I took it not as advise but as a flame and thus started ranting more and more. I thankfully have grown up since those old days.  I am now 33 and Married to a lovley Wife called Sarah.  She too was abused as a Child and understands all that I went through.  We both chuckled at the original posts by me and I think I was verging on the Scitzo. I would like to appologise to people in this group that knew the old me.  I have come a long way in my recovery.  I even started a group called Aspergers World 3.  This was set up to help people with the same Condition as myself. I would like to post a special Appology to Celeste57 and Silverleaf who got a lot of my anger way back in 1998. Both tried to help me where as others could have blocked me.  Both tried to tell me that I could have some kind of Autism.  I did not beleive them and had I of just looked into it things may have been clearer in my mind. Anyway take care call, Steve http://clix.to/chemer

  Response:

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  

• SAVAGERY!

  Question:

  On 13 Dec 2003 11:39:27 -0000, Anonymous-Remai…@See.Comment.Header.gmsociety.org (jane) wrote: >NOTE: This message was sent thru a mail2news gateway. >No effort was made to verify the identity of the sender. >——————————————————– >will try to just keep in journal and share with thpst for now. want no more >’savegry’ here.  bad word. >jane

  Hi Jane, Don’t do that. You keep on coming here and sharing what you feel. Your poem was not "Savagery" but honesty. Don’t take on Hal’s feelings, they belong to him and he has to deal with them. I’m really sorry you got that reaction to what you wrote. When I read it, it did touch something in me, but I saw nothing wrong with you sharing those feelings, I accepted the responsibility for my feelings after reading it, and Hal must do the same. I also don’t agree that you are causing any hurt or anger here. When I read Hal’s post I did get angry, and I told him so, not to be hurtful to him, but to remind him of what this forum is all about. He was wrong to attack you, and when I read his response to your poem I was so angry I was shaking, but not because of you, because of him. His attitude that if it is dark and scary it shouldn’t be said just riled me, because whenever I try to share my thoughts and feelings about my trauma I always get the "shut up and forget it" attitude. I believe that we are ever to heal, we have to tell the truth about what happened to us and how it affected and continues to affect us. Don’t let one ignorant person deny you of your right to tell the truth, that is what this newsgroup is for. Please don’t be silent. Your voice helps all of us to heal. Take care. Jamilyn – you say I’m a bitch like it’s a bad thing

  Response:

  "HAL 9000" <mur…@neobee.net> wrote in message

  news:brb7md$kl9$1@shiva.neobee.net… > If you knew what a word SUPPORT means than you’d understood how > inappropriate > is the every word written in that "poem". > This is a Support Group and nothing else.

  And just who the fuck are you, the support group police?  Its isn’t meant for any kind of > language.

  You are a newcomer here, and yet you proceed to come in and tell people what this group is for?  Go back over the archives.  This group has always been open to it’s members posting what ever thoughts they’ve had/needed to get out of their minds.  There has been much more graphic material posted here in the past, and sometimes without spoilers, although spoilers are recommended for those members who choose to not read something.  Every one of us could write similar bunch of worst symptoms but > that wouldn’t certainly couldn’t give any SUPPORT to anyone! > SUPPORT considers sharing opinions, asking for advice and finding > information…

  You obviously do not have PTSD.  What you’ve labeled as a poem was simply someones fears/thoughts/pains, written out in form. > I could write much worse and more frightening stuff which I’ve experienced, > but what good would that bring to anyone else on this group? Intention of > SUPPORT is to ease problems and get at least virtual comfort in crisis > moments. > If you believe that what was written in that post is anything but a evil > spam, that you certainly have no idea about humanity.

  And you sir, have no idea what PTSD entails. snipped a whole bunch of crappola> > Therefore, I think that rules for posting here are the same for all people, > with or without PTSD.

  I don’t believe an election was held here recently that nominated you to speak for this group.  I’ve been here for years and you certainly didn’t get my vote.  I’ll repeat, IF YOU DON’T WANT TO READ SOMETHING, DON’T READ IT, but don’t proceed to tell others, especially those who have been here for ma ny years, what is and isn’t permissible to post here. td – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

  Response:

  "tinydancer" <tinydan…@nospam.com> wrote in news:filCb.8391$T14.7408@bignews3.bellsouth.net: > "HAL 9000" <mur…@neobee.net> wrote in message > news:brb7md$kl9$1@shiva.neobee.net… >> If you knew what a word SUPPORT means than you’d understood how >> inappropriate >> is the every word written in that "poem". >> This is a Support Group and nothing else. > And just who the fuck are you, the support group police?

  Uh, Ohhh!! Quick!! Upgrade TD to Fruitcake Level 4…….. quickly!! — Peter Lucas                           K

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  

• The recipe for being each other's salvation

  Question:

  says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – says… Perhaps. But I have always wondered about this "salvation." Just what am I being saved from…death…myself…fate? A life that’s not worthy of being lived. Ilya, my life is fine. I do not need to be saved from anything. I’m not talking about you. Marx, to start with. But also Smith, Darwin, LaFargue, Russell, Bentham, Mills, Huxley, Santayana, Marcuse, Camus, Sartre, von Ranke, Hoffer, Ayer, Etzioni, etc. And, of course, Thoreau. I tend toward Logical Positivism, democratic socialism, environmentalism, etc. What appeal do you see in logical positivism?

  Truth; uncontaminated by sentimentality, myth, or self-delusion. Clarity in a world of confusion. A steady platform from which to manipulate the verbal archetypes. (My mind is made still and quiet in the midst of the chaos.) What can be, in all humility, known. And what is mere airy speculation. Rules governing what may be safely believed. It is impossible to turn a true logical positivist into a fanatic for any transitory cult. Cat

  Response:

  i think i understand what you’re saying… i’m not arguing the need to have someone in one’s life to love, to learn from, to be close to…but that the person can’t be my savior.  in terms of relearning things like healthy sexual expresson (whatever definition one uses for that), trusting, re-feeling…the best they can be is a helpmate, not a savior.   course that’s my opinion..others vary naomi – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – if i’m going to be asked to be someone else’s savior then i’m going to run to the hills…if i’m going to try and use someone else as my savior then i’m looking in the wrong place. no one can "save" me but me, and anyone who insists on using me as their salvation is going to be woefully disappointed. salvation, whatever you mean by that term, cannot come from the external. hi naomi.. i agree with what you are saying here….. emotionally and psychologically… but… i have questions sometimes inside myself that are still not answered, they might one day or maybe not… you see, after the years of child abuse (from at least 4 up to 14 year old) i had a long period of total silence and blockked about sexuality; it’s only much much later that i started to think about what i saw around me, life, books, movies etc and thought why not give it a try…. as funny as life is, it then brought me in situations where i then was open and i had some lovers, maybe i have been quite lucky with a husband who was a sculptors and actually really maked me love my own body as an art and i also discovered pleasure; so i would say that he being who he was teaches me and brought me to ways and openess and pleasure that other men wouldn’t; without knowing it he helped me…. so, i went my own way throught life including a fulfilled sexuality and emotional relations as well…. you see, at 33, i got raped very violently.. and my reaction to that was itself very violent, full of dispair and it took me really years to get me out of very insane, violent and dangerous situations; my chances was that i had a good therapist, friends and support group that helped me not to "moralize" what i was doing but helped me then to understand that this was my way today to react and work out the violence of the rape and of my rejection of a violent death between other things…… now, i suppose lots of moralistic short minded persons would consider me more "healthy" but to be honest i don’t think i am simply because i became totally able to relate sexually to anybody and even less to myself, i absolutely can’t touch myself or i would hurt me badly – it happens once; i won’t do it again – so you see, sometimes i thought how in hell am i going to be able to reinstall something sane, pleasant and peaceful…. there has been times, when i was feeling a voice inside saying hey, i want calins, i want to be touched, i want to be loved…. yeah? but we are stuck in there so, i tried to search for solutions, one was going out at night and pick up someone just for a short time, but that wasn’t safe enough because i might be terribly triggered and fall on to someone that would in fact more rape me than helped me out…… (well, there was also the question that when i got raped i was for many years a lesbian, so why would i go for a guy??, but that’s something else) so, i am really questioning myself about Ilya expression… after all there might be some people around in this world able to give love for a while what is necessary for the recovery… at times, i am even envious/jaleous of the therapy cal had, which is imho highly beneficial, but honestly i think that sexuality is a several person relation so, the interaction between the persons is important – except of course if you consider sexuality as one person act – what would be abusive, would be for him for example to stay and grab on people, but if he act with love, care and respect and let the persons goes away when they feel like it’s time, i would say he probably had done a good job somewhere…. love then, can indeed be a healing energy for real concretely…. i believe this world needs lovers, and there are too few of them nowadays, too many abusers instead of real lovers, maybe it’s time to reaffirm their necessity without transforming them in prostitutes by the "moralists religious craps"… phoenix who still don’t know …. and sometimes have to listen to the voice inside challanging her…. ah, internal conflicts, lots of books could be written about them, but i believe lots of books have been and are indeed written Is love that combines grace and passion; that is a choice as well as a feeling; that sees the other person and chooses to be forgiving and understanding as well as cherishes her and burns for her from within. It is love that combines Ayn Rand’s ideal of passionately burning for the other with Jesus’s ideal of forgiveness. For a relationship conceived in passion to lead to good lasting results, the Christlike element has to be there, enveloping the passion and unifying it in a shroud. It wasn’t there in the relationship between Ayn Rand and Nathaniel Brandon, which is why it ended in disaster. It was there in the relationship between me and the woman I love, and we have both been healed.

  Response:

  - Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – says… Is love that combines grace and passion; that is a choice as well as a feeling; that sees the other person and chooses to be forgiving and understanding as well as cherishes her and burns for her from within. It is love that combines Ayn Rand’s ideal of passionately burning for the other with Jesus’s ideal of forgiveness. For a relationship conceived in passion to lead to good lasting results, the Christlike element has to be there, enveloping the passion and unifying it in a shroud. It wasn’t there in the relationship between Ayn Rand and Nathaniel Brandon, which is why it ended in disaster. It was there in the relationship between me and the woman I love, and we have both been healed. Perhaps. But I have always wondered about this "salvation." Just what am I being saved from…death…myself…fate?

  A life that’s not worthy of being lived. You know Ilya, I don’t like Ayn Rand. She was a crappy writer. Objectivism is nothing more than vile and greedy "selfishness" raised to the level of a "virtue." (Yes, darling, I’ve read that too.) Potato salad? Cat (so young, so cynical…damn that Marxist existentialism!)

  WHo in particular?

  Response:

  if i’m going to be asked to be someone else’s savior then i’m going to run to the hills…if i’m going to try and use someone else as my savior then i’m looking in the wrong place. no one can "save" me but me, and anyone who insists on using me as their salvation is going to be woefully disappointed. salvation, whatever you mean by that term, cannot come from the external. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is love that combines grace and passion; that is a choice as well as a feeling; that sees the other person and chooses to be forgiving and understanding as well as cherishes her and burns for her from within. It is love that combines Ayn Rand’s ideal of passionately burning for the other with Jesus’s ideal of forgiveness. For a relationship conceived in passion to lead to good lasting results, the Christlike element has to be there, enveloping the passion and unifying it in a shroud. It wasn’t there in the relationship between Ayn Rand and Nathaniel Brandon, which is why it ended in disaster. It was there in the relationship between me and the woman I love, and we have both been healed.

  Response:

  says… Perhaps. But I have always wondered about this "salvation." Just what am I being saved from…death…myself…fate? A life that’s not worthy of being lived. Ilya, my life is fine. I do not need to be saved from anything.

  I’m not talking about you. Marx, to start with. But also Smith, Darwin, LaFargue, Russell, Bentham, Mills, Huxley, Santayana, Marcuse, Camus, Sartre, von Ranke, Hoffer, Ayer, Etzioni, etc. And, of course, Thoreau. I tend toward Logical Positivism, democratic socialism, environmentalism, etc.

  What appeal do you see in logical positivism?

  Response:

  says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – says… Is love that combines grace and passion; that is a choice as well as a feeling; that sees the other person and chooses to be forgiving and understanding as well as cherishes her and burns for her from within. It is love that combines Ayn Rand’s ideal of passionately burning for the other with Jesus’s ideal of forgiveness. For a relationship conceived in passion to lead to good lasting results, the Christlike element has to be there, enveloping the passion and unifying it in a shroud. It wasn’t there in the relationship between Ayn Rand and Nathaniel Brandon, which is why it ended in disaster. It was there in the relationship between me and the woman I love, and we have both been healed. Perhaps. But I have always wondered about this "salvation." Just what am I being saved from…death…myself…fate? A life that’s not worthy of being lived.

  Ilya, my life is fine. I do not need to be saved from anything. You know Ilya, I don’t like Ayn Rand. She was a crappy writer. Objectivism is nothing more than vile and greedy "selfishness" raised to the level of a "virtue." (Yes, darling, I’ve read that too.) Potato salad? Cat (so young, so cynical…damn that Marxist existentialism!) WHo in particular?

  Marx, to start with. But also Smith, Darwin, LaFargue, Russell, Bentham, Mills, Huxley, Santayana, Marcuse, Camus, Sartre, von Ranke, Hoffer, Ayer, Etzioni, etc. And, of course, Thoreau. I tend toward Logical Positivism, democratic socialism, environmentalism, etc. Cat soc.singles deleted from the header/alt.abuse.recovery left in – for now.

  Response:

  if i’m going to be asked to be someone else’s savior then i’m going to run to the hills…if i’m going to try and use someone else as my savior then i’m looking in the wrong place.

  It’s not a matter of using, it’s a matter of being. It’s a matter of doing something for one another. no one can "save" me but me, and anyone who insists on using me as their salvation is going to be woefully disappointed.

  Then that’s you. salvation, whatever you mean by that term, cannot come from the external.

  YOu betcharass it can.

  Response:

  i think i understand what you’re saying… i’m not arguing the need to have someone in one’s life to love, to learn

  from, to be close to…but that the person can’t be my savior.  in terms of relearning things like healthy sexual expresson (whatever definition one uses for that), trusting, re-feeling…the best they can be is a helpmate, not a savior. course that’s my opinion..others vary naomi

  yes, i agree, actually just while i send my post i thought that maybe it was the use of the world savior and salvation that was totally wrong, but not per s

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  

• Relationship addiction and inner child therapy?

  Question:

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – At age 31, I finally discovered why the women who I am most attracted to, always abandon me and run away when the relationship starts to get close and then run back to me when their own fear of abandonment kicks in. I am a text book case of a Love Addict, while most of these women seem to be avoidance addicts. I am aware of the SLAA 12-step program and I currently attend SLAA meetings. However I truly believe that the fundamental cause of my love addiction are issues from childhood that must be healed. A 12 step program is not going to change the type of women who I naturally find attractive, its not going to change the type of women who become obsessed with me and seduce me and its not going to stop the intense emotions and grip these woman have over me when these type of relationships occur. However, I would love to hear any detailed dissenting opinions on this. I have recently looked into inner child healing. Many people on the net have sworn by its effectiveness with codependency and relationship addiction issues. I have been doing some guided imagery excersizes from an Inner Child Workbook to learn more about my metaphorical inner infant and inner toddler. I have yet to find any significant relief from the pain, but then I still not have yet been able to release and greive some of this pain from childhood. As I am currently unemployed, I don’t have the money nor the health coverage to cover a therapist and I am looking to empower myself with some tools to help me with the pain and the obsession on my own. Reading over 20 books on the subject gave me knowledge, but knowledge is not the same as healing.

  Look up a book, "I want to change, but I don’t know how." I am quite certain that my fundamental issues are fear of intimacy caused by fear of abandonment. I simply have little romantic attraction to emotionally available women. When these women abandon me, the pain is extreme, and I obsess about the situation for months. My biggest curiousity is what is the psychological phenomenon that occurs that makes inner child healing effective in healing childhood wounds that effect adult relationships? And why isn’t inner child healing more popular, considering how so many couples have problems in their relationships that involve strong emotions?

  It is, It’s called Psychology. Get a real therapist that will treat the whole thing, the whole person (that will include the inner child), not just the segment that you seem to have discovered. There is so much more to it that you haven’t even scratched upon. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would love to hear from others who have similar issues. Perhaps some of you can help me interpret some of the guided imagery from the inner child excersizes. Inner Infant: After closing my eyes and imagining that I was surrounded by a bright light and entering a meadow, I had a picture of my inner infant laying in a crib. He was for the most part happy, smiling, cooing and making noises, but was squirming a bit, kicking his feet and lifting his arms. He made eye contact with me and was clearly trying to communicate with me. Inner Toddler: (Same light and meadow scene). I had a picture of a 2-3 year old little boy sitting in an empty room on the side of a bed wearing 2-piece feety pajamas, holding a stuffed animal. His look is sullen. He looks like he has been spending alot of time alone. His eyes look like he was crying before. When making eye contact, his look says "Don’t leave me". He says nothing. Not sure if this has any significance, but his diaper was wet (not overly as in neglectfull).

  You have abandonment issues, and likely form insecure attachments. But that’s all just a tiny little piece of the puzzle.  You also need to learn how to take care of the inner toddler, YOU, not someone else has to do that. Noone else is equipped to do that. Question: Can the accuracy of guided imagery be affected by biases in the adult reality?

  Inner child reflects your emotional self, your emotional needs. If the inner child is unhappy, you’re neglecting yourself in one way or another.    BUT, that’s just one little facet of your inner child. Thanks

  If I were you, I’d go see a therapist, (a decent practicing psychologist) They will work this out with you, and then some. In most people what drives us more complex than just love addiction, or just fear of intimacy… They’re all symptoms.  If the source of the symptoms isn’t treated, they’ll just come back. Personally, I don’t like 12 step programs. Have you been abused or traumatized as a child? How was your relationship with your parents? Are your parents happy people?

  Response:

  - Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – At age 31, I finally discovered why the women who I am most attracted to, always abandon me and run away when the relationship starts to get close and then run back to me when their own fear of abandonment kicks in. I am a text book case of a Love Addict, while most of these women seem to be avoidance addicts. I am aware of the SLAA 12-step program and I currently attend SLAA meetings. However I truly believe that the fundamental cause of my love addiction are issues from childhood that must be healed. A 12 step program is not going to change the type of women who I naturally find attractive, its not going to change the type of women who become obsessed with me and seduce me and its not going to stop the intense emotions and grip these woman have over me when these type of relationships occur. However, I would love to hear any detailed dissenting opinions on this. I have recently looked into inner child healing. Many people on the net have sworn by its effectiveness with codependency and relationship addiction issues. I have been doing some guided imagery excersizes from an Inner Child Workbook to learn more about my metaphorical inner infant and inner toddler. I have yet to find any significant relief from the pain, but then I still not have yet been able to release and greive some of this pain from childhood. As I am currently unemployed, I don’t have the money nor the health coverage to cover a therapist and I am looking to empower myself with some tools to help me with the pain and the obsession on my own. Reading over 20 books on the subject gave me knowledge, but knowledge is not the same as healing. I am quite certain that my fundamental issues are fear of intimacy caused by fear of abandonment. I simply have little romantic attraction to emotionally available women. When these women abandon me, the pain is extreme, and I obsess about the situation for months. My biggest curiousity is what is the psychological phenomenon that occurs that makes inner child healing effective in healing childhood wounds that effect adult relationships? And why isn’t inner child healing more popular, considering how so many couples have problems in their relationships that involve strong emotions? I would love to hear from others who have similar issues. Perhaps some of you can help me interpret some of the guided imagery from the inner child excersizes. Inner Infant: After closing my eyes and imagining that I was surrounded by a bright light and entering a meadow, I had a picture of my inner infant laying in a crib. He was for the most part happy, smiling, cooing and making noises, but was squirming a bit, kicking his feet and lifting his arms. He made eye contact with me and was clearly trying to communicate with me. Inner Toddler: (Same light and meadow scene). I had a picture of a 2-3 year old little boy sitting in an empty room on the side of a bed wearing 2-piece feety pajamas, holding a stuffed animal. His look is sullen. He looks like he has been spending alot of time alone. His eyes look like he was crying before. When making eye contact, his look says "Don’t leave me". He says nothing. Not sure if this has any significance, but his diaper was wet (not overly as in neglectfull). Question: Can the accuracy of guided imagery be affected by biases in the adult reality? Thanks

  Wow! I cannot believe you can be so open minded about such topics! I have myself done some inner child work and found it very beneficial. Your imagery is very powerful. My interpretation would be that as a baby you were happy and loved but as you became a toddler you learnt the world was unpredictable and scary. Somewhere between being a baby and becoming a toddler you were taught that you were unlovable. I believe the reason that you seek the same women is that on some level you don’t feel that you deserve genuine love. This possibly came from a woman figure and is unresolved in your subconscious therefore creating more and more of the similar women to come into your life until it is resolved. This pattern will repeat until you deal with the original source. Then again i may not be making any sense and if this is true I apologize

  Response:

  Dear You whoever, I am sorry to learn of your hurt and relationship problems. I have had a similar problem,but with men – I am female,and suffered a lot of rejection and hate as a child. It is not sufficient to learn to love oneself.  I have always loved myself – but it is true, that one has to learn that there are some people out there who are capable of affection and who genuinely like one for whom one is. Each boyfriend I have had has been better than the one before, and I want a good relationship one day, so I am working towards that goal. Love does heal, and  you must want to let other people into your life. The best advice I can give you is that once you learn that you are strong enough to be alone and cope with possible loss or rejection, it frees you to be less demanding in a relationship and enjoy the time together more. Things take time and I hope you let some warm and affectionate and emotionally free person into your life, and let them help to  heal you. Good luck.

  Response:

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – At age 31, I finally discovered why the women who I am most attracted to, always abandon me and run away when the relationship starts to get close and then run back to me when their own fear of abandonment kicks in. I am a text book case of a Love Addict, while most of these women seem to be avoidance addicts. I am aware of the SLAA 12-step program and I currently attend SLAA meetings. However I truly believe that the fundamental cause of my love addiction are issues from childhood that must be healed. A 12 step program is not going to change the type of women who I naturally find attractive, its not going to change the type of women who become obsessed with me and seduce me and its not going to stop the intense emotions and grip these woman have over me when these type of relationships occur. However, I would love to hear any detailed dissenting opinions on this. I have recently looked into inner child healing. Many people on the net have sworn by its effectiveness with codependency and relationship addiction issues. I have been doing some guided imagery excersizes from an Inner Child Workbook to learn more about my metaphorical inner infant and inner toddler. I have yet to find any significant relief from the pain, but then I still not have yet been able to release and greive some of this pain from childhood. As I am currently unemployed, I don’t have the money nor the health coverage to cover a therapist and I am looking to empower myself with some tools to help me with the pain and the obsession on my own. Reading over 20 books on the subject gave me knowledge, but knowledge is not the same as healing. I am quite certain that my fundamental issues are fear of intimacy caused by fear of abandonment. I simply have little romantic attraction to emotionally available women. When these women abandon me, the pain is extreme, and I obsess about the situation for months. My biggest curiousity is what is the psychological phenomenon that occurs that makes inner child healing effective in healing childhood wounds that effect adult relationships? And why isn’t inner child healing more popular, considering how so many couples have problems in their relationships that involve strong emotions? I would love to hear from others who have similar issues. Perhaps some of you can help me interpret some of the guided imagery from the inner child excersizes. Inner Infant: After closing my eyes and imagining that I was surrounded by a bright light and entering a meadow, I had a picture of my inner infant laying in a crib. He was for the most part happy, smiling, cooing and making noises, but was squirming a bit, kicking his feet and lifting his arms. He made eye contact with me and was clearly trying to communicate with me. Inner Toddler: (Same light and meadow scene). I had a picture of a 2-3 year old little boy sitting in an empty room on the side of a bed wearing 2-piece feety pajamas, holding a stuffed animal. His look is sullen. He looks like he has been spending alot of time alone. His eyes look like he was crying before. When making eye contact, his look says "Don’t leave me". He says nothing. Not sure if this has any significance, but his diaper was wet (not overly as in neglectfull). Question: Can the accuracy of guided imagery be affected by biases in the adult reality? Thanks Wow! I cannot believe you can be so open minded about such topics! I have myself done some inner child work and found it very beneficial. Your imagery is very powerful. My interpretation would be that as a baby you were happy and loved but as you became a toddler you learnt the world was unpredictable and scary. Somewhere between being a baby and becoming a toddler you were taught that you were unlovable. I believe the reason that you seek the same women is that on some level you don’t feel that you deserve genuine love. This possibly came from a woman figure and is unresolved in your subconscious therefore creating more and more of the similar women to come into your life until it is resolved. This pattern will repeat until you deal with the original source. Then again i may not be making any sense and if this is true I apologize

  FFS just go and get what you want with out trying to analyse every part of your life to explain an occasional failure that most men experience and quickly forget about. You are brooding rather than moving on. smicker www.smicker.co.uk Updated 16th June

  Response:

  Wow! I cannot believe you can be so open minded about such topics! I have myself done some inner child work and found it very beneficial. Your imagery is very powerful. My interpretation would be that as a baby you were happy and loved but as you became a toddler you learnt the world was unpredictable and scary. Somewhere between being a baby and becoming a toddler you were taught that you were unlovable. I believe the reason that you seek the same women is that on some level you don’t feel that you deserve genuine love. This possibly came from a woman figure and is unresolved in your subconscious therefore creating more and more of the similar women to come into your life until it is resolved. This pattern will repeat until you…SNIP

  You won’t get over it until you,… Grow up, get a life, get your mind out of your underwear, learn to be productive and responsible for your actions without using a half-baked theory as a crutch? The answers to life’s questions are the ones people don’t want to hear. That’s why no one pays people to tell them the truth unless they’re gonna write em a nice ’scrip to tske the edge off of it. jen "Ahoy Sissy!  Whatcha got in yer mouth, Sissy??" Bloodhound Gang — Posted via http://web2news.com the faster web2news on the web

  Response:

     Hey!  I thought *I* was the troll!!!

  Perhaps you need to work on a more positive self image — Patrick Brighton, England

  Response:

         Hey!  I thought *I* was the troll!!! Perhaps you need to work on a more positive self image

          Perhaps.  Perhaps not.                                          Glenn S.                         "Home Grown" 12 Step Recovery Website at…                              http://members.aol.com/GlennS1956                          Suffering = clinging to that which changes…

  Response:

         I’m sure that everyone from alt.recovery.from-12-steps agrees with you!                                         Glenn S. Glenn still fighting w/ the trolls I see.

          Hey!  I thought *I* was the troll!!!                                          Glenn S.                         "Home Grown" 12 Step Recovery Website at…                              http://members.aol.com/GlennS1956                          Suffering = clinging to that which changes…

  Response:

  - Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – lucky ones ass beat shooting each other "behavior disorders"    psychobabblers I immediately spanked model citizens. You are very wise, IMO.    I’m sure that everyone from alt.recovery.from-12-steps agrees with you!                                     Glenn S.

  Glenn still fighting w/ the trolls I see.

  Response:

  - Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –        Is that "inner child" stuff still around?  I thought that was LAST week’s psychobabble fad of the week.        This week’s psychobabble fad of the week is  ADHD.  It is caused by child psychiatrist’s door frames.  Every kid that passes through them catches it. You are my new hero!!! I couldn’t agree more. Fucking psychiatrists’        I just calls ‘em like I sees ‘em.  If psychiatrists told parents of unruly kids what they really need to hear, i.e., "Go home and beat his little ass", they wouldn’t get kickbacks from the drug companies that push those kiddie drugs. I wasn’t one of the lucky ones that got my ass beat, by my parents. Nope, I had to learn things the hard way.        When our parents whipped our asses years ago, the biggest problems we had in school were throwing spitballs and sticking gum under the desktop.  Now that the psychobabblers tell parents to "affirm children’s individuality", "validate their feelings", and "give them these pills", kids are shooting each other in school. You are absolutely right. Now every time a kid acts up in class he/she is ADD. Labeling these kids with these "behavior disorders" is nothing more than the excuse of today, and it is NOT helping.        To keep the pills flowing, schools and psychobabblers now teach kids to call Social Services on parents when they threaten to spank them.  Every time my kids ever threatened to call Social Services on me for threatening to spank them, I immediately spanked their asses for THAT.  Now they’re grown, and are model citizens. You are very wise, IMO.

          I’m sure that everyone from alt.recovery.from-12-steps agrees with you!                                          Glenn S.                         "Home Grown" 12 Step Recovery Website at…                              http://members.aol.com/GlennS1956                          Suffering = clinging to that which changes…

  Response:

          Is that "inner child" stuff still around?  I thought that was LAST week’s psychobabble fad of the week.         This week’s psychobabble fad of the week is  ADHD.  It is caused by child psychiatrist’s door frames.  Every kid that passes through them catches it.                                          Glenn S.                         "Home Grown" 12 Step Recovery Website at…                              http://members.aol.com/GlennS1956                          Suffering = clinging to that which changes…

  Response:

         Is that "inner child" stuff still around?  I thought that was LAST week’s psychobabble fad of the week.        This week’s psychobabble fad of the week is  ADHD.  It is caused by child psychiatrist’s door frames.  Every kid that passes through them catches it. You are my new hero!!! I couldn’t agree more. Fucking psychiatrists’

  Hear hear! The inner child/infant/toddler needs to be smothered with a pillow and the adult that’s left should grow a spine and work on being a singular person before inflicting himself on the general population. Good thing I’m not a therapist! jen — Posted via http://web2news.com the faster web2news on the web

  Response:

         Is that "inner child" stuff still around?  I thought that was LAST week’s psychobabble fad of the week.        This week’s psychobabble fad of the week is  ADHD.  It is caused by child psychiatrist’s door frames.  Every kid that passes through them catches it. You are my new hero!!! I couldn’t agree more. Fucking psychiatrists’

          I just calls ‘em like I sees ‘em.  If psychiatrists told parents of unruly kids what they really need to hear, i.e., "Go home and beat his little ass", they wouldn’t get kickbacks from the drug companies that push those kiddie drugs.         When our parents whipped our asses years ago, the biggest problems we had in school were throwing spitballs and sticking gum under the desktop.  Now that the psychobabblers tell parents to "affirm children’s individuality", "validate their feelings", and "give them these pills", kids are shooting each other in school.         To keep the pills flowing, schools and psychobabblers now teach kids to call Social Services on parents when they threaten to spank them.  Every time my kids ever threatened to call Social Services on me for threatening to spank them, I immediately spanked their asses for THAT.  Now they’re grown, and are model citizens.                                          Glenn S.                         "Home Grown" 12 Step Recovery Website at…                              http://members.aol.com/GlennS1956                          Suffering = clinging to that which changes…

  Response:

  However, I would love to hear any detailed dissenting opinions on this.

  Simply said, recovery and progress comes with the bitter salty tears coming out of the brain. There are lots of ways to do this, and some things will not work for you since you are a unique individual and you need to find what works for you. The applied psychophysiology interventions work the best. The longer one has to wait to heal up the PTSD issues of child abuse (or any traumatic vectored incident), the longer the healing process takes. In my own recovery that is over 20 years now, I think I have cried a total of about 2 years … if I stacked it up all in a row. When I got into IBP Therapy, which I was ripe for with all the 12 step and inner child stuff I did, with dream work and journal work and lots of other stuff … I was crying every day for 6 months before I got on the winning side of it. Some people have less time with this – other people have more time with it. If you are making progress in your disease, by isolating ALL external acting out behaviours and doing the work … the emotions and the tears will come out of you.  You will see yourself changing and becoming a better human being.  Others will notice this as well and will mention it. Sumbuddie who cares

  Response:

  At age 31, I finally discovered why the women who I am most attracted to, always abandon me and run away when the relationship starts to get close and then run back to me when their own fear of abandonment kicks in. I am a text book case of a Love Addict, while most of these women seem to be avoidance addicts. I am aware of the SLAA 12-step program and I currently attend SLAA meetings. However I truly believe that the fundamental cause of my love addiction are issues from childhood that must be healed. A 12 step program is not going to change the type of women who I naturally find attractive, its not going to change the type of women who become obsessed with me and seduce me and its not going to stop the intense emotions and grip these woman have over me when these type of relationships occur. However, I would love to hear any detailed dissenting opinions on this. I have recently looked into inner child healing. Many people on the net have sworn by its effectiveness with codependency and relationship addiction issues. I have been doing some guided imagery excersizes from an Inner Child Workbook to learn more about my metaphorical inner infant and inner toddler. I have yet to find any significant relief from the pain, but then I still not have yet been able to release and greive some of this pain from childhood. As I am currently unemployed, I don’t have the money nor the health coverage to cover a therapist and I am looking to empower myself with some tools to help me with the pain and the obsession on my own. Reading over 20 books on the subject gave me knowledge, but knowledge is not the same as healing. I am quite certain that my fundamental issues are fear of intimacy caused by fear of abandonment. I simply have little romantic attraction to emotionally available women. When these women abandon me, the pain is extreme, and I obsess about the situation for months. My biggest curiousity is what is the psychological phenomenon that occurs that makes inner child healing effective in healing childhood wounds that effect adult relationships? And why isn’t inner child healing more popular, considering how so many couples have problems in their relationships that involve strong emotions? I would love to hear from others who have similar issues. Perhaps some of you can help me interpret some of the guided imagery from the inner child excersizes. Inner Infant: After closing my eyes and imagining that I was surrounded by a bright light and entering a meadow, I had a picture of my inner infant laying in a crib. He was for the most part happy, smiling, cooing and making noises, but was squirming a bit, kicking his feet and lifting his arms. He made eye contact with me and was clearly trying to communicate with me. Inner Toddler: (Same light and meadow scene). I had a picture of a 2-3 year old little boy sitting in an empty room on the side of a bed wearing 2-piece feety pajamas, holding a stuffed animal. His look is sullen. He looks like he has been spending alot of time alone. His eyes look like he was crying before. When making eye contact, his look says "Don’t leave me". He says nothing. Not sure if this has any significance, but his diaper was wet (not overly as in neglectfull). Question: Can the accuracy of guided imagery be affected by biases in the adult reality? Thanks

  Response:

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  

• wondering if this is true….

  Question:

  accurately naming a thing, especially an emotion … allows one to deal with it .. with more accuracy.  After recovery (and I am still doing if after some 20 years or so) the diagnosis is just part of the journey in looking back over the path of life.  Which is empty and meaningless at the end of one’s days. that is a pair of dimes windy – not just a few cents. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My 2 cents is that a diagnosis means little – if you don’t have an organic problem – which most here don’t.  Concentrate on the goal you have of recovery and what you want to be and forget about the diagnosis – its meaningless after recovery.

  Response:

  ccurately naming a thing, especially an emotion … allows one to deal with it .. with more accuracy.

  I’m not sure I agree with this – unless it would be something organic.  I kind of think its only pertinet to insurance companies.  One can deal with something emotional without labelling it – some folks get lost in the diagnosis and spend useless time dealing with that.  And on top of that – just my opinion for both – you can visit 5 professionals or doctors and get five different diagnoses for the same set of symptoms in non-organic stuff.  Dizzy making idiocy. What you feel when and how you act upon it is much more valuable.  But then I’m weird about how I look at that therapy stuff.   After recovery (and I am still doing if after some 20 years or so) the diagnosis is just part of the journey in looking back over the path of life.  Which is empty and meaningless at the end of one’s days.

  I don’t discount that its interesting and maybe has some value – however, for me, once the therapy process started it became unimportant   If I had dwelled on the diagnosis, and all the understood symptoms – I would have remain overwhelmed and probably wasted a lot of good therapy time. Most everything we desparately seek and covet – ends up useless at the end of this portion of our jouney. Windy Windy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -that is a pair of dimes windy – not just a few cents.

  Response:

  Good for you … Multiple Personality Disorder is not a psychiatric mental disease … it is a response to traumatic stress events and is amenable to be healed … set things straight.  The applied psychophysiology interventions work best; mind talk only goes so far.  Just detox the brain of the bitter salty tears; a simple process that is hard to do.  When it happens, try to step out of the way and let it do what it wants to do.  No fear, there is only love. sumbuddie who cares – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slykitten, I agree with what Bethney has to say here, but…. always a bit…. Many people with MPD (as myself) don’t realize they have MPD until they are adults. Sooooo although PTSD can not become MPD/DID in adulthood, it can help create MPD/DID in childhood which could not be realized until adulthood. My own mental health disorders include PTSD, MPD/DID, and Bi-Polar none of which were realized until adulthood. THANK YOU!!! you’ve confirmed that what our counselor had told us was a load of BS! I was wondering if you’ve got any links or other resources I can check out so I can study this…. I"ve read up in all of my psychology books but they only touch on the subject, not really elaborating…. I definately appreciate this! mostly because I have a diagnosis of PTSD and was concerned that perhaps I was gonna one day end up with some sort of DID or MPD…. it was suggested by the psychiatrist who did my recent evaluation that I may have developed a sort of Dissociative Disorder as a way to cope with some of the symptoms of the PTSD (night terrors/ nightmares, aggression from overwhelming stress, needing to feel safe and so I end up locking myself inside the house until I feel it’s safe to come out…) but without further testing, all he can say safely is that it’s only a speculation. Hi Slykitten: I just had to respond to you ….. from everything I’ve *EVER* studied/known about DID … is that PTSD doesn’t turn into DID – especially as an adult. DID forms mostly (only?) when the person is very young and is just forming personality-wise. Loads of people, however, suffer from PTSD. Good luck Bethany thanks! I’ve done some research at the NIMH website on PTSD…. it doesn’t tell me anything that I don’t already know from either experience or from what I learned from counselors/psychology class…. the next step I think is to look up the varying types of therapy. If I come across anything, I’ll also post it here cuz I know that there are some who may want that info… Dear Slykitten, You are wise beyond your years.  Just because someone has a diploma hanging on the wall, doesn’t mean it’s wise to take what they say as the truth. But that goes for anyone, it’s always a good idea to do your own research…if nothing else, just so that you can be more informed.  I really don’t know the answer to your question, but I do know that DID is extremely rare. And if people go through PTSD in circumstances like wars, family traumas, abuse of various kinds, hijackings, etc. which they do in large numbers, and the instances of DID are still extremely rare….then I would feel it safe to say, that maybe it’s possible…(PTSD developing into DID)…..but if it happens, it’s very rare. One thing that isn’t rare, is the fact that I write in long run on sentences ;o) Now that you brought up that good question, I’ll start doing some research myself.  If I find anything about it, I’ll post you a link. Sincerely~ Ally I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy…. http://www.insanitygirl.com

  Response:

  Thanks… that’s at least a beginning for me…. right now, I’ve lost faith in the healthcare system…. it’s almost as if they’re handing out degrees/diplomas in the mental health field like they’re handing out candy at halloween…. it’s sad that many of the counselors I’ve been to have turned out to either be wacked out themselves or are just not qualified…. <<shudder frightening!!

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Schizophrenia’s origins are generally organic in nature. For a period of time, off hand I’m thinking the late 1918 through perhaps the 30s or 40’s mpd and some dissociations were erroneously referred to as schizophrenia.  They are in fact quite different.  Also there are various categories of schizophrenia. Brief Reactive Psychosis also is sometimes misdiagnosed as schizophrenia. At least if my memory serves me right. Panther that’s kinda what I thought…. but this particular counselor insisted that in adulthood, PTSD turns into MPD/DID… I’d figure, realistically speaking, that when a person is developing their personality (usually as a child) any trauma that is overwhelming is dealt with the only way the body knows how…. sometimes that means stuffing it in an area to store until the person can handle it or it becomes manifested as a "disorder" but I’m not a psychiatrist nor am I a psychologist so I’m not 1000% sure exactly what happens when and how…. or why. this guy was basically "diagnosing" me as having a MPD/DID situation as a result of my PTSD…. my psychiatrist on the otherhand says that I definately have an "exacerbated" form of PTSD at the current time but some symptoms suggest DD as a way for me to cope…. I think my goal right now is to educate myself. I want to know all I can about these things so I can basically be on the same page as the counselor or doctor. now, I’ve another question…. I’ve heard that PTSD is a mild form of a type of schizophrenia…. I just see it as having a hard time dealing with stress, causing anxiety…. I’m being handed a whole bunch of frightening categories for what I have going on emotionally/psychologically…. is PTSD in the schizophrenia category? Slykitten,    I agree with what Bethney has to say here, but…. always a bit…. Many people with MPD (as myself) don’t realize they have MPD until they are adults. Sooooo although PTSD can not become MPD/DID in adulthood, it can help create MPD/DID in childhood which could not be realized until adulthood.   My own mental health disorders include PTSD, MPD/DID, and Bi-Polar none of which were realized until adulthood. THANK YOU!!! you’ve confirmed that what our counselor had told us was a load of BS! I was wondering if you’ve got any links or other resources I can check out so I can study this…. I"ve read up in all of my psychology books but they only touch on the subject, not really elaborating…. I definately appreciate this! mostly because I have a diagnosis of PTSD and was concerned that perhaps I was gonna one day end up with some sort of DID or MPD…. it was suggested by the psychiatrist who did my recent evaluation that I may have developed a sort of Dissociative Disorder as a way to cope with some of the symptoms of the PTSD (night terrors/ nightmares, aggression from overwhelming stress, needing to feel safe and so I end up locking myself inside the house until I feel it’s safe to come out…) but without further testing, all he can say safely is that it’s only a speculation. Hi Slykitten: I just had to respond to you ….. from everything I’ve *EVER* studied/known about DID … is that PTSD doesn’t turn into DID – especially as an adult. DID forms mostly (only?) when the person is very young and is just forming personality-wise. Loads of people, however, suffer from PTSD. Good luck Bethany thanks! I’ve done some research at the NIMH website on PTSD…. it doesn’t tell me anything that I don’t already know from either experience or from what I learned from counselors/psychology class…. the next step I think is to look up the varying types of therapy. If I come across anything, I’ll also post it here cuz I know that there are some who may want that info… Dear Slykitten, You are wise beyond your years.  Just because someone has a diploma hanging on the wall, doesn’t mean it’s wise to take what they say as the truth. But that goes for anyone, it’s always a good idea to do your own research…if nothing else, just so that you can be more informed.  I really don’t know the answer to your question, but I do know that DID is extremely rare. And if people go through PTSD in circumstances like wars, family traumas, abuse of various kinds, hijackings, etc. which they do in large numbers, and the instances of DID are still extremely rare….then I would feel it safe to say, that maybe it’s possible…(PTSD developing into DID)…..but if it happens, it’s very rare. One thing that isn’t rare, is the fact that I write in long run on sentences ;o) Now that you brought up that good question, I’ll start doing some research myself.  If I find anything about it, I’ll post you a link. Sincerely~ Ally I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy…. — Free Anonymous Email Accounts & WebHosting for sexual abuse survivors http://www.asarian-intl.org http://www.asar-intl.com http://www.asarian-intl.org/inpsyte

  Response:

  that’s kinda what I thought…. but this particular counselor insisted that in adulthood, PTSD turns into MPD/DID… I’d figure, realistically speaking, that when a person is developing their personality (usually as a child) any trauma that is overwhelming is dealt with the only way the body knows how…. sometimes that means stuffing it in an area to store until the person can handle it or it becomes manifested as a "disorder" but I’m not a psychiatrist nor am I a psychologist so I’m not 1000% sure exactly what happens when and how…. or why. this guy was basically "diagnosing" me as having a MPD/DID situation as a result of my PTSD…. my psychiatrist on the otherhand says that I definately have an "exacerbated" form of PTSD at the current time but some symptoms suggest DD as a way for me to cope…. I think my goal right now is to educate myself. I want to know all I can about these things so I can basically be on the same page as the counselor or doctor. now, I’ve another question…. I’ve heard that PTSD is a mild form of a type of schizophrenia…. I just see it as having a hard time dealing with stress, causing anxiety…. I’m being handed a whole bunch of frightening categories for what I have going on emotionally/psychologically…. is PTSD in the schizophrenia category?

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slykitten,    I agree with what Bethney has to say here, but…. always a bit…. Many people with MPD (as myself) don’t realize they have MPD until they are adults. Sooooo although PTSD can not become MPD/DID in adulthood, it can help create MPD/DID in childhood which could not be realized until adulthood.   My own mental health disorders include PTSD, MPD/DID, and Bi-Polar none of which were realized until adulthood. THANK YOU!!! you’ve confirmed that what our counselor had told us was a load of BS! I was wondering if you’ve got any links or other resources I can check out so I can study this…. I"ve read up in all of my psychology books but they only touch on the subject, not really elaborating…. I definately appreciate this! mostly because I have a diagnosis of PTSD and was concerned that perhaps I was gonna one day end up with some sort of DID or MPD…. it was suggested by the psychiatrist who did my recent evaluation that I may have developed a sort of Dissociative Disorder as a way to cope with some of the symptoms of the PTSD (night terrors/ nightmares, aggression from overwhelming stress, needing to feel safe and so I end up locking myself inside the house until I feel it’s safe to come out…) but without further testing, all he can say safely is that it’s only a speculation. Hi Slykitten: I just had to respond to you ….. from everything I’ve *EVER* studied/known about DID … is that PTSD doesn’t turn into DID – especially as an adult. DID forms mostly (only?) when the person is very young and is just forming personality-wise. Loads of people, however, suffer from PTSD. Good luck Bethany thanks! I’ve done some research at the NIMH website on PTSD…. it doesn’t tell me anything that I don’t already know from either experience or from what I learned from counselors/psychology class…. the next step I think is to look up the varying types of therapy. If I come across anything, I’ll also post it here cuz I know that there are some who may want that info… Dear Slykitten, You are wise beyond your years.  Just because someone has a diploma hanging on the wall, doesn’t mean it’s wise to take what they say as the truth. But that goes for anyone, it’s always a good idea to do your own research…if nothing else, just so that you can be more informed.  I really don’t know the answer to your question, but I do know that DID is extremely rare. And if people go through PTSD in circumstances like wars, family traumas, abuse of various kinds, hijackings, etc. which they do in large numbers, and the instances of DID are still extremely rare….then I would feel it safe to say, that maybe it’s possible…(PTSD developing into DID)…..but if it happens, it’s very rare. One thing that isn’t rare, is the fact that I write in long run on sentences ;o) Now that you brought up that good question, I’ll start doing some research myself.  If I find anything about it, I’ll post you a link. Sincerely~ Ally I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….       http://www.insanitygirl.com

  Response:

  Hi Slykitten: I just had to respond to you ….. from everything I’ve *EVER* studied/known about DID … is that PTSD doesn’t turn into DID – especially as an adult. DID forms mostly (only?) when the person is very young and is just forming personality-wise. Loads of people, however, suffer from PTSD. Good luck Bethany

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – thanks! I’ve done some research at the NIMH website on PTSD…. it doesn’t tell me anything that I don’t already know from either experience or from what I learned from counselors/psychology class…. the next step I think is to look up the varying types of therapy. If I come across anything, I’ll also post it here cuz I know that there are some who may want that info… Dear Slykitten, You are wise beyond your years.  Just because someone has a diploma hanging on the wall, doesn’t mean it’s wise to take what they say as the truth. But that goes for anyone, it’s always a good idea to do your own research…if nothing else, just so that you can be more informed.  I really don’t know the answer to your question, but I do know that DID is extremely rare. And if people go through PTSD in circumstances like wars, family traumas, abuse of various kinds, hijackings, etc. which they do in large numbers, and the instances of DID are still extremely rare….then I would feel it safe to say, that maybe it’s possible…(PTSD developing into DID)…..but if it happens, it’s very rare. One thing that isn’t rare, is the fact that I write in long run on sentences ;o) Now that you brought up that good question, I’ll start doing some research myself.  If I find anything about it, I’ll post you a link. Sincerely~ Ally I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  THANK YOU!!! you’ve confirmed that what our counselor had told us was a load of BS! I was wondering if you’ve got any links or other resources I can check out so I can study this…. I"ve read up in all of my psychology books but they only touch on the subject, not really elaborating…. I definately appreciate this! mostly because I have a diagnosis of PTSD and was concerned that perhaps I was gonna one day end up with some sort of DID or MPD…. it was suggested by the psychiatrist who did my recent evaluation that I may have developed a sort of Dissociative Disorder as a way to cope with some of the symptoms of the PTSD (night terrors/ nightmares, aggression from overwhelming stress, needing to feel safe and so I end up locking myself inside the house until I feel it’s safe to come out…) but without further testing, all he can say safely is that it’s only a speculation.

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Slykitten: I just had to respond to you ….. from everything I’ve *EVER* studied/known about DID … is that PTSD doesn’t turn into DID – especially as an adult. DID forms mostly (only?) when the person is very young and is just forming personality-wise. Loads of people, however, suffer from PTSD. Good luck Bethany thanks! I’ve done some research at the NIMH website on PTSD…. it doesn’t tell me anything that I don’t already know from either experience or from what I learned from counselors/psychology class…. the next step I think is to look up the varying types of therapy. If I come across anything, I’ll also post it here cuz I know that there are some who may want that info… Dear Slykitten, You are wise beyond your years.  Just because someone has a diploma hanging on the wall, doesn’t mean it’s wise to take what they say as the truth. But that goes for anyone, it’s always a good idea to do your own research…if nothing else, just so that you can be more informed.  I really don’t know the answer to your question, but I do know that DID is extremely rare. And if people go through PTSD in circumstances like wars, family traumas, abuse of various kinds, hijackings, etc. which they do in large numbers, and the instances of DID are still extremely rare….then I would feel it safe to say, that maybe it’s possible…(PTSD developing into DID)…..but if it happens, it’s very rare. One thing that isn’t rare, is the fact that I write in long run on sentences ;o) Now that you brought up that good question, I’ll start doing some research myself.  If I find anything about it, I’ll post you a link. Sincerely~ Ally I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  thanks! I’ve done some research at the NIMH website on PTSD…. it doesn’t tell me anything that I don’t already know from either experience or from what I learned from counselors/psychology class…. the next step I think is to look up the varying types of therapy. If I come across anything, I’ll also post it here cuz I know that there are some who may want that info…

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear Slykitten, You are wise beyond your years.  Just because someone has a diploma hanging on the wall, doesn’t mean it’s wise to take what they say as the truth. But that goes for anyone, it’s always a good idea to do your own research…if nothing else, just so that you can be more informed.  I really don’t know the answer to your question, but I do know that DID is extremely rare. And if people go through PTSD in circumstances like wars, family traumas, abuse of various kinds, hijackings, etc. which they do in large numbers, and the instances of DID are still extremely rare….then I would feel it safe to say, that maybe it’s possible…(PTSD developing into DID)…..but if it happens, it’s very rare. One thing that isn’t rare, is the fact that I write in long run on sentences ;o) Now that you brought up that good question, I’ll start doing some research myself.  If I find anything about it, I’ll post you a link. Sincerely~ Ally I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  Dear Slykitten, You are wise beyond your years.  Just because someone has a diploma hanging on the wall, doesn’t mean it’s wise to take what they say as the truth.  But that goes for anyone, it’s always a good idea to do your own research…if nothing else, just so that you can be more informed.  I really don’t know the answer to your question, but I do know that DID is extremely rare.  And if people go through PTSD in circumstances like wars, family traumas, abuse of various kinds, hijackings, etc. which they do in large numbers, and the instances of DID are still extremely rare….then I would feel it safe to say, that maybe it’s possible…(PTSD developing into DID)…..but if it happens, it’s very rare. One thing that isn’t rare, is the fact that I write in long run on sentences ;o) Now that you brought up that good question, I’ll start doing some research myself.  If I find anything about it, I’ll post you a link. Sincerely~ Ally

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  I’ve managed to work through an incredible amount of my triggers…. but that was with a *qualified* counselor… in fact, I’m still working with our family psychologist…. this in home counselor is more of a social worker than someone who knows much about psychology…. some of what I’m "getting" from keeping certain things alive is a reminder that I cannot let anyone hurt me ever again…. again, that comes from some counselors being unable to truly get to the heart of the matter with me…. but I don’t know that necessarily it all falls on my ex’s shoulders somehow…. we’re trying to figure out if it goes back further….. when I had my psych eval done with the psychiatrist, he said that I probably had PTSD a lot longer than anyone knew or realized…. because I never went through counseling as a kid, it’s hard to judge…. so in some ways, we’re kinda forced to go backwards before we can truly progress. I got a lot of work to do….

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – X-No-Archive: yes In some cases – that could be the case – such as a small child left in the everyday terror of abuse would probably first experience PTSD and if the abuse were to go on would find some other way to adjust.  The couselor should learn to keep those kinds of opinions to themselves however – it borders on suggestion and therefore borders on unethical. In my humble opinion – when triggers are discovered that is half the battle of removing them – often they are used to manipulate if that doesn’t happen. Someone should have provided you with therapy to stay with what is happening in the present so you don’t.  Perhaps his frustration is that you are are not willing to do that but find the drama you create beneficial somehow. My opiinons about triggers are not the norm around here and tend to be rather harsh.  I’ve been reading the same kind of thing for you for more than a year now – for me that would have been time enough to work through it. I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy…. — For more information about this NNTP posting service, contact: If you want an anonymous account, visit our sign-up page: https://asarian-host.net/cgi-bin/signup.cgi

  Response:

  yaa, what she said — just dial up the knob of energy in the form of traumatic stress vectors and you got a simple case of PTSD turning into MPD. The human mind can only handle so much – and it fragments – then splits if it has to.  The more intelligent and gifted and talented the person – the more they fracture.  Big ego – Big cracking up … ha ha. People who have been sexually abuse – have the same problems as those people who have NOT been sexually abused. Same issues with boundaries, containment, community, relationship, trust, yada yada yada. Just that sex is life and sex is energy and it cranks up the knob. Dealing with death does the same thing – cranks up the knob of life. It comes out with more power – more energy – but same shit to make into fertalizer and grow. In my detoxing the bitter salty tears – I have ripped muscles from bones and torn tendons with my body learning how to relax and not be such a hard ass. sumbuddie who cares – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – dissociation is a continuum, like points on a line.  every person alive is on that line.  there is daydreaming, there is the drive home you do so many times that you no longer really remember details of one specific drive home because you’ve done it so often it’s remote control, then there’s mentally becoming absent in stressful situations as sometimes happens with accident survivors even if they haven’t been knocked unconscious so they can’t clearly remember, or remember at all, the event, right long the line to splitting off and creating new personalities to suit the needs. and there is everything between those things listed above. severe, and frequently ongoing trauma of some sort is usually required for a person to develop MPD or DID.  The pattern of severe dissociation begins in young childhood and becomes an effective coping mechanism for dealing with repeated abuses.  but, there have been children who split off because of shock from a car accident, extreme burn etc to help them deal with the physical and emotional pain of that event. i’ve never heard of an adult who was singular (one intact personality)suddently developing more than on personality, except in cases of where they’re on trial wanting to lessen the severity of their sentences. there’s lots of sites out there about MPD/DID where you can get more accurate and informative information than i can offer… naomi I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  dissociation is a continuum, like points on a line.  every person alive is on that line.  there is daydreaming, there is the drive home you do so many times that you no longer really remember details of one specific drive home because you’ve done it so often it’s remote control, then there’s mentally becoming absent in stressful situations as sometimes happens with accident survivors even if they haven’t been knocked unconscious so they can’t clearly remember, or remember at all, the event, right long the line to splitting off and creating new personalities to suit the needs. and there is everything between those things listed above. severe, and frequently ongoing trauma of some sort is usually required for a person to develop MPD or DID.  The pattern of severe dissociation begins in young childhood and becomes an effective coping mechanism for dealing with repeated abuses.  but, there have been children who split off because of shock from a car accident, extreme burn etc to help them deal with the physical and emotional pain of that event. i’ve never heard of an adult who was singular (one intact personality)suddently developing more than on personality, except in cases of where they’re on trial wanting to lessen the severity of their sentences. there’s lots of sites out there about MPD/DID where you can get more accurate and informative information than i can offer… naomi – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  Then get that one Dak … Get the "Sybil" videotape I guess … this is why I love this place so much .. you get good direction for recovery here. My memory keeps making it up that Sally Field’s character "Sybil" had at least 3 personalities in her MPD.  At the end of the movie – Joanne Woodward is sitting in Central Park in New York I think, doing some hand nitting – and Sally Field is acting out doing her numing stuff … and Joanne keeps doing all the healthy stuff … mirroring, pacing, boundaries, just keeping a loving energy going … and then the MPD just stops and the integration occurs.  Takes a few years. With applied psychophysiology interventions it goes faster. And thanks for not talking down to me this time – its refreshing cinymngirl. sumbuddie who cares – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sally Field was not in The Three Faces of Eve, Alan.  She was Sybil.  Joanne Woodward, who played Eve, also appeared in Sybil as Sally Fields’ psychiatrist. Sure, in most cases it is just a continumum … there have been people in this NG who had MPD and then integrated with recovery – keep making progress. The movie "Three Faces of Eve" with Joanne Woodward and Sally Field … is a good video to go see.  How child abuse and continued torture during the right times of development makes things turn out a certain predictable way with the PTSD issues. People who have just been mentally abused, emotionally abused, psychologcially abused … no belts – no spoons, no blood, no broken bones – their recovery is a lot harder. Like John Ashcroft – likely the man was never abused as a child with belts and hairbrushes and insanity like kneeling on rice kernals on a wood floor for hours. So to Ashcroft putting a burka on a woman is just good sense from his daddy and his 2000 year old mentality. Just unthinking – maybe stupid activity based on brainwashing Ashcroft has not awaken from. Maybe go to his deathbed with his insanity like Ron Reagan. sumbuddie on da watchtower I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  Sally Field was not in The Three Faces of Eve, Alan.  She was Sybil.  Joanne Woodward, who played Eve, also appeared in Sybil as Sally Fields’ psychiatrist. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sure, in most cases it is just a continumum … there have been people in this NG who had MPD and then integrated with recovery – keep making progress. The movie "Three Faces of Eve" with Joanne Woodward and Sally Field … is a good video to go see.  How child abuse and continued torture during the right times of development makes things turn out a certain predictable way with the PTSD issues. People who have just been mentally abused, emotionally abused, psychologcially abused … no belts – no spoons, no blood, no broken bones – their recovery is a lot harder. Like John Ashcroft – likely the man was never abused as a child with belts and hairbrushes and insanity like kneeling on rice kernals on a wood floor for hours. So to Ashcroft putting a burka on a woman is just good sense from his daddy and his 2000 year old mentality. Just unthinking – maybe stupid activity based on brainwashing Ashcroft has not awaken from. Maybe go to his deathbed with his insanity like Ron Reagan. sumbuddie on da watchtower I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  Oh Dak, other times it is not true. 90% of the time – all the issues are emotionally based and just need to detox the brain of the bitter salty tears – and the problems magically go away.  Simple process that hurts like hell … sometimes can bring tears out for a year or two of therapy depending on PTSD vectors and time of disease. The other 10% of the time – there is actually a broken brain (psychophysiology)  and they need meds for the rest of their lives … and medication monitoring with blood chemistry assay like thyroid levels for example … forever until they die.  They can do pretty good this way, maybe not drive a car or hold a job.  Women who have brain seizures from brain trauma – assault and accident – as well as men – can present very well at times. sumbuddie who cares – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  PTSD can turn into DID , but only if you have BIM , SOR , VHG and DOZ but some might cancell each other out , leaving you with PIQ , SIB , or the dreaded MYO

  Response:

  Sure, in most cases it is just a continumum … there have been people in this NG who had MPD and then integrated with recovery – keep making progress. The movie "Three Faces of Eve" with Joanne Woodward and Sally Field … is a good video to go see.  How child abuse and continued torture during the right times of development makes things turn out a certain predictable way with the PTSD issues. People who have just been mentally abused, emotionally abused, psychologcially abused … no belts – no spoons, no blood, no broken bones – their recovery is a lot harder. Like John Ashcroft – likely the man was never abused as a child with belts and hairbrushes and insanity like kneeling on rice kernals on a wood floor for hours. So to Ashcroft putting a burka on a woman is just good sense from his daddy and his 2000 year old mentality. Just unthinking – maybe stupid activity based on brainwashing Ashcroft has not awaken from. Maybe go to his deathbed with his insanity like Ron Reagan. sumbuddie on da watchtower – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was told by our in home counselor that PTSD can turn into DID (dissociative identity disorder) or a form of multiple personality…. is it true? I don’t believe it but if someone can point me in the right direction of where to begin research, please, feel free to let me know…. keep in mind that this "counselor" is finishing up his studies to be a clinical "psychiatrist" but to be honest, I’m not at all that impressed by him considering that he’s unable to deal with me when certain things that either he does or sometimes my bf does that reminds me of my ex…. and trigger me. I just want to make sure that i"m not being fed a load of bullshit from this guy….

  Response:

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  

• Eating question

  Question:

  Thanks Beverly for your kind wishes — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Rose, I don’t have an answer to your question.  Glad to see you’re well on the road to recovery. Beverly Hi everyone, I have a query about eating and weight loss.  Since having my surgery (4 weeks ago on Monday)  I have lost 8kg (17.6lbs).  From week 2 to week 3 I was eating 2 tablespoons of food 3 times a day but the past week I have doubled that.  I know it’s a good thing but I was wondering, if my body gets use to that small amount of food and then the following week I eat more but still under my calories/fat for the day, will I still continue to lose weight or will it stop because I am eating more. I hope I’ve explained this one right.  I was wondering as my weight has remained the same since my discharge 2 weeks ago.  Hey I’m not complaining because losing that large amount of weight from not being able to eat and then eat but still maintain it is excellent. Does anyone have opinions on this one? Thanks in advance — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  Hi Rose, I don’t have an answer to your question.  Glad to see you’re well on the road to recovery. Beverly

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi everyone, I have a query about eating and weight loss.  Since having my surgery (4 weeks ago on Monday)  I have lost 8kg (17.6lbs).  From week 2 to week 3 I was eating 2 tablespoons of food 3 times a day but the past week I have doubled that.  I know it’s a good thing but I was wondering, if my body gets use to that small amount of food and then the following week I eat more but still under my calories/fat for the day, will I still continue to lose weight or will it stop because I am eating more. I hope I’ve explained this one right.  I was wondering as my weight has remained the same since my discharge 2 weeks ago.  Hey I’m not complaining because losing that large amount of weight from not being able to eat and then eat but still maintain it is excellent. Does anyone have opinions on this one? Thanks in advance — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  Thanks Roxan.  I will keep that in mind.  My exercise right now is limited but I am walking.  The incision is still painful and using my stomach muscles still hurts and I’ve been told to not commence any other exercise apart from walking for another 2 weeks.  I’m definitely eating 500 calories less than before I had the surgery so I guess eating what I am won’t change my weightloss at all. Thanks again — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Weight loss slows down when you are eating too little, as you start eating more you will start to lose again as long as you are eating 500 calories less then you are burning you will lose 1 pound a week. Roxan Hi everyone, I have a query about eating and weight loss.  Since having my surgery (4 weeks ago on Monday)  I have lost 8kg (17.6lbs).  From week 2 to week 3 I was eating 2 tablespoons of food 3 times a day but the past week I have doubled that.  I know it’s a good thing but I was wondering, if my body gets use to that small amount of food and then the following week I eat more but still under my calories/fat for the day, will I still continue to lose weight or will it stop because I am eating more. I hope I’ve explained this one right.  I was wondering as my weight has remained the same since my discharge 2 weeks ago.  Hey I’m not complaining because losing that large amount of weight from not being able to eat and then eat but still maintain it is excellent. Does anyone have opinions on this one? Thanks in advance — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  No Rosie, I haven’t been referred to a dietician.  My surgeon just said that I can’t eat meat and bread until 6 weeks post op just incase it gets stuck in the oesophagus and it will give it time to heal better.  He is happy with what I am eating but I am not sure if I need more guidance with it.  When he rebuilt the valve, he said he used more stomach than expected so I have a long wrap in there with a little stomach.  And if I eat more that I should, I get incredible pain in my shoulders from my diaphragm.  Maybe I should ring him and ask about a dietician? — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – rose, your are going to get alot of different opinions from this — read and post, rosie You grow up the first day you have the first real laugh-at yourself. Hi everyone, I have a query about eating and weight loss.  Since having my surgery (4 weeks ago on Monday)  I have lost 8kg (17.6lbs).  From week 2 to week 3 I was eating 2 tablespoons of food 3 times a day but the past week I have doubled that.  I know it’s a good thing but I was wondering, if my body gets use to that small amount of food and then the following week I eat more but still under my calories/fat for the day, will I still continue to lose weight or will it stop because I am eating more. I hope I’ve explained this one right.  I was wondering as my weight has remained the same since my discharge 2 weeks ago.  Hey I’m not complaining because losing that large amount of weight from not being able to eat and then eat but still maintain it is excellent. Does anyone have opinions on this one? Thanks in advance — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  Weight loss slows down when you are eating too little, as you start eating more you will start to lose again as long as you are eating 500 calories less then you are burning you will lose 1 pound a week. Roxan

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi everyone, I have a query about eating and weight loss.  Since having my surgery (4 weeks ago on Monday)  I have lost 8kg (17.6lbs).  From week 2 to week 3 I was eating 2 tablespoons of food 3 times a day but the past week I have doubled that.  I know it’s a good thing but I was wondering, if my body gets use to that small amount of food and then the following week I eat more but still under my calories/fat for the day, will I still continue to lose weight or will it stop because I am eating more. I hope I’ve explained this one right.  I was wondering as my weight has remained the same since my discharge 2 weeks ago.  Hey I’m not complaining because losing that large amount of weight from not being able to eat and then eat but still maintain it is excellent. Does anyone have opinions on this one? Thanks in advance — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  rose, your are going to get alot of different opinions from this — read and post, rosie You grow up the first day you have the first real laugh-at yourself.

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi everyone, I have a query about eating and weight loss.  Since having my surgery (4 weeks ago on Monday)  I have lost 8kg (17.6lbs).  From week 2 to week 3 I was eating 2 tablespoons of food 3 times a day but the past week I have doubled that.  I know it’s a good thing but I was wondering, if my body gets use to that small amount of food and then the following week I eat more but still under my calories/fat for the day, will I still continue to lose weight or will it stop because I am eating more. I hope I’ve explained this one right.  I was wondering as my weight has remained the same since my discharge 2 weeks ago.  Hey I’m not complaining because losing that large amount of weight from not being able to eat and then eat but still maintain it is excellent. Does anyone have opinions on this one? Thanks in advance — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  Hi everyone, I have a query about eating and weight loss.  Since having my surgery (4 weeks ago on Monday)  I have lost 8kg (17.6lbs).  From week 2 to week 3 I was eating 2 tablespoons of food 3 times a day but the past week I have doubled that.  I know it’s a good thing but I was wondering, if my body gets use to that small amount of food and then the following week I eat more but still under my calories/fat for the day, will I still continue to lose weight or will it stop because I am eating more. I hope I’ve explained this one right.  I was wondering as my weight has remained the same since my discharge 2 weeks ago.  Hey I’m not complaining because losing that large amount of weight from not being able to eat and then eat but still maintain it is excellent. Does anyone have opinions on this one? Thanks in advance — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  

• They Know Not What They Do

  Question:

  Time Magazine     May 6, 2002       Article by Andrew Sullivan Even in Rome, the U.S. Cardinals still forgot the children I had to read the sentence twice to make sure I wasn’t imagining it.  In the text of the American Cardinals’ statement issued last week in Rome, the hierarchs specified which statutory rapists among their clergy would be subject to being defrocked.  Such a punishment would be meted out to "a priest who has become notorious and is guilty of the serial, predatory, sexual abuse of minors."  Excuse me?  Why on earth is the "notoriety" of a child abuser in any way relevant to punishment for his crime (except as an excuse for the church to avoid sifting through past allegations that remain unpublicized?)  Then there were these loopholes: the abuse also had to be "serial" and "predatory". Occasional or one-off child-abuse violations could perhaps be forgiven.  And even serial abuse might be overlooked if it had not been "predatory".  A simple question: How is an adult’s exploitation of a minor ever anything but predatory? We have learned one simeple thing from last week:  the highest officials of the largest Christian denomination on earth have lower standards with regard to the protection of children and minors than secular criminal law does.  The endorsement of "zero tolerance" by Philadelphia’s Anthony Cardinal Bevilacq last Saturday (good post-Rome spin) is still not official policy.  I can’t believe I’m writing this –but they still don’t get it.  And if they cannot get the enormity of the crimes their clergy have committed, they are even further from acknowledging their own role in enabling them.  No one has resigned.  No one has taken responsibility.  And on the two central issues behind this scandal, there is no movement.  The first is the authoritarian governing structure of the church, whereby a self-selected elite makes every decision for hundreds of millions of people.  When you have a structure like this–immunie from outside input–it is bound to create crises like this one.  It has no real means of self-correction.  The system creates incentives for secrecy and cover-ups that are often just as bad as the crime.  But none of that is on the table.  In fact, a critical element for recovery–boards of inquiry composed of lay people, not just clergy–was not even mentioned in the text. As for a frank discussion of sexual morality, celibacy, women priests or homosexuality, it’s not likely to happen anytime soon.  The usual diversions designed to avoid these subjects were thrown about with abandon.  This is a purely American problem, some church spokesmen argued, as if scandals weren’t exploding elsewhere:  an ABC News report charged the Vatican itself with covering up abuse claims against a priest previously praised by the Pope.  Then there was the scapegoating of gays.  Equating homosexuality with child abuse is one of the oldest slanders there is–but this church doesn’t hesitate to invoke it to deflect attention from its own culpability.  Besides, now we know that perhaps as many as half of America’s priests are believed to be gay.  A church that still preaches that homosexuals are "intrinsically disordered" relies on thse allegedly sick people to run its dioceses, churches and schools.  Talk about cognitive dissonance. As a Catholic struggling to keep the faith through all this, I find myself asking: Why?  Why can these men not get the enormity of what has happened?  The best I can come up with is that they are well-intentioned men who somehow cannot see that what they have enabled is systematic child rape.  They resist deep change by claiming that celibacy isn’t the issue.  But the hierarchy’s cover-up of this evil surely has something to do with celibacy.  Today’s church leaders see sex primarily as an act, fraught with moral danger, not as a relationship, imbued with moral good. And how could they think otherwise?  They have never known sexual relations–only sexual fantasy, masturbation and struggle.  So perhaps it never occurred to them, as the writer Michael Sean Winters has pointed out, to see this abuse from the *child’s* point of view. That is why this crisis is of profound importance.  One of Jesus’ main teachings was the dignity of the vulnerable–children central among them. Unless you are like a child, Jesus taught, you will never enter the Kingdom of Heaven.  When Jesus’ own church, far from protecting children, molests them and shields their abusers, the sin goes to the heart of what the church is about. And when its leaders cannot take full responsibility, the sin can only metastasize.  Bernard Cardinal Law didn’t even attend the press conference last week to explain the Cardinals’ statement to the people he serves and the families he betrayed.  "[It] was rather late, you know," he told reporters.  "I had other things to do."  Forgive him, for he knows not what he does.

  Response:

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Time Magazine     May 6, 2002       Article by Andrew Sullivan Even in Rome, the U.S. Cardinals still forgot the children I had to read the sentence twice to make sure I wasn’t imagining it.  In the text of the American Cardinals’ statement issued last week in Rome, the hierarchs specified which statutory rapists among their clergy would be subject to being defrocked.  Such a punishment would be meted out to "a priest who has become notorious and is guilty of the serial, predatory, sexual abuse of minors."  Excuse me?  Why on earth is the "notoriety" of a child abuser in any way relevant to punishment for his crime (except as an excuse for the church to avoid sifting through past allegations that remain unpublicized?)  Then there were these loopholes: the abuse also had to be "serial" and "predatory". Occasional or one-off child-abuse violations could perhaps be forgiven. And even serial abuse might be overlooked if it had not been "predatory".  A simple question: How is an adult’s exploitation of a minor ever anything but predatory? We have learned one simeple thing from last week:  the highest officials of the largest Christian denomination on earth have lower standards with regard to the protection of children and minors than secular criminal law does.  The endorsement of "zero tolerance" by Philadelphia’s Anthony Cardinal Bevilacq last Saturday (good post-Rome spin) is still not official policy.  I can’t believe I’m writing this –but they still don’t get it.  And if they cannot get the enormity of the crimes their clergy have committed, they are even further from acknowledging their own role in enabling them.  No one has resigned. No one has taken responsibility.  And on the two central issues behind this scandal, there is no movement.  The first is the authoritarian governing structure of the church, whereby a self-selected elite makes every decision for hundreds of millions of people.  When you have a structure like this–immunie from outside input–it is bound to create crises like this one.  It has no real means of self-correction.  The system creates incentives for secrecy and cover-ups that are often just as bad as the crime.  But none of that is on the table.  In fact, a critical element for recovery–boards of inquiry composed of lay people, not just clergy–was not even mentioned in the text. As for a frank discussion of sexual morality, celibacy, women priests or homosexuality, it’s not likely to happen anytime soon.  The usual diversions designed to avoid these subjects were thrown about with abandon.  This is a purely American problem, some church spokesmen argued, as if scandals weren’t exploding elsewhere:  an ABC News report charged the Vatican itself with covering up abuse claims against a priest previously praised by the Pope. Then there was the scapegoating of gays.  Equating homosexuality with child abuse is one of the oldest slanders there is–but this church doesn’t hesitate to invoke it to deflect attention from its own culpability.  Besides, now we know that perhaps as many as half of America’s priests are believed to be gay.  A church that still preaches that homosexuals are "intrinsically disordered" relies on thse allegedly sick people to run its dioceses, churches and schools. Talk about cognitive dissonance. As a Catholic struggling to keep the faith through all this, I find myself asking: Why?  Why can these men not get the enormity of what has happened? The best I can come up with is that they are well-intentioned men who somehow cannot see that what they have enabled is systematic child rape.  They resist deep change by claiming that celibacy isn’t the issue.  But the hierarchy’s cover-up of this evil surely has something to do with celibacy.  Today’s church leaders see sex primarily as an act, fraught with moral danger, not as a relationship, imbued with moral good. And how could they think otherwise? They have never known sexual relations–only sexual fantasy, masturbation and struggle.  So perhaps it never occurred to them, as the writer Michael Sean Winters has pointed out, to see this abuse from the *child’s* point of view. That is why this crisis is of profound importance.  One of Jesus’ main teachings was the dignity of the vulnerable–children central among them. Unless you are like a child, Jesus taught, you will never enter the Kingdom of Heaven.  When Jesus’ own church, far from protecting children, molests them and shields their abusers, the sin goes to the heart of what the church is about. And when its leaders cannot take full responsibility, the sin can only metastasize.  Bernard Cardinal Law didn’t even attend the press conference last week to explain the Cardinals’ statement to the people he serves and the families he betrayed.  "[It] was rather late, you know," he told reporters.  "I had other things to do."  Forgive him, for he knows not what he does.

  Perhaps we should get back to the basic laws of most communities … catholic churches and their clergy should register as possible – or past – sex offenders in every community they exist.

  Response:

  Time Magazine     May 6, 2002       Article by Andrew Sullivan Even in Rome, the U.S. Cardinals still forgot the children I had to read the sentence twice to make sure I wasn’t imagining it.  In the text of the American Cardinals’ statement issued last week in Rome, the hierarchs specified which statutory rapists among their clergy would be subject to being defrocked.  Such a punishment would be meted out to "a priest who has become notorious and is guilty of the serial, predatory, sexual abuse of minors."

  Unless you havn’t been paying attention to all the news and only picking out the salacious bits, what the cardinals were promoting is a special process for special cases.  The current method of defrocking a priest (for any reason) is slow and tedious (as even the guilty have rights).  The cardinals were just looking of a new process to be used.  This does *not* mean that the current process would be discarded.

  Response:

  Earlier I posted an article by Andrew Sullivan, which read in part: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Even in Rome, the U.S. Cardinals still forgot the children I had to read the sentence twice to make sure I wasn’t imagining it.  In the text of the American Cardinals’ statement issued last week in Rome, the hierarchs specified which statutory rapists among their clergy would be subject to being defrocked.  Such a punishment would be meted out to "a priest who has become notorious and is guilty of the serial, predatory, sexual abuse of minors." Unless you havn’t been paying attention to all the news and only picking out the salacious bits, what the cardinals were promoting is a special process for special cases.  The current method of defrocking a priest (for any reason) is slow and tedious (as even the guilty have rights).  The cardinals were just looking of a new process to be used.  This does *not* mean that the current process would be discarded.

  Apparently, you have serious difficulty in reading and understanding a post. 1.  What I posted was an article written in Time Magazine by Andrew Sullivan. I *clearly* identified the source and author…..so your   "unless *you* (emphasis added) haven’t been paying attention….."  is an astonishing misreading of a very simple post. 2.  What "salacious" bits?  There was nothing sexually arousing in Sullivan’s article….that is, unless you have an unusual kink that kicks in whenever you hear "serial, predatory, sexual abuse of minors."   3.  Sullivan’s point, which you missed entirely, was that the cardinals’ mentioning *SERIAL* as a condition for defrocking was an implied tolerance of the abuse of minors in instances that weren’t notorious. Also an implied tolerance of the predator who abuses perhaps once or twice but isn’t quite in the league of Geohgan or Shanley. Two days *after* the cardinals’ statement was released, causing an uproar throughout the U.S.,   the cardinal in Philadelphia issued an "oops" clarification:  in June the U.S. bishops’ conference would vote for a zero-tolerance policy, which contradicts what the cardinals endorsed in their statement.   Let us hope the conference of bishops displays more wisdom and decency than the American cardinals by voting in a zero-tolerance policy and a policy of reporting allegations of abuse to the authorities. Mac

  Response:

  - Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Earlier I posted an article by Andrew Sullivan, which read in part: Even in Rome, the U.S. Cardinals still forgot the children I had to read the sentence twice to make sure I wasn’t imagining it.  In the text of the American Cardinals’ statement issued last week in Rome, the hierarchs specified which statutory rapists among their clergy would be subject to being defrocked.  Such a punishment would be meted out to "a priest who has become notorious and is guilty of the serial, predatory, sexual abuse of minors." Unless you havn’t been paying attention to all the news and only picking out the salacious bits, what the cardinals were promoting is a special process for special cases.  The current method of defrocking a priest (for any reason) is slow and tedious (as even the guilty have rights).  The cardinals were just looking of a new process to be used.  This does *not* mean that the current process would be discarded. Apparently, you have serious difficulty in reading and understanding a post. 1.  What I posted was an article written in Time Magazine by Andrew Sullivan. I *clearly* identified the source and author…..so your   "unless *you* (emphasis added) haven’t been paying attention….."  is an astonishing misreading of a very simple post. 2.  What "salacious" bits?  There was nothing sexually arousing in Sullivan’s article….that is, unless you have an unusual kink that kicks in whenever you hear "serial, predatory, sexual abuse of minors." 3.  Sullivan’s point, which you missed entirely, was that the cardinals’ mentioning *SERIAL* as a condition for defrocking was an implied tolerance of the abuse of minors in instances that weren’t notorious. Also an implied tolerance of the predator who abuses perhaps once or twice but isn’t quite in the league of Geohgan or Shanley. Two days *after* the cardinals’ statement was released, causing an uproar throughout the U.S.,   the cardinal in Philadelphia issued an "oops" clarification:  in June the U.S. bishops’ conference would vote for a zero-tolerance policy, which contradicts what the cardinals endorsed in their statement.

  Bevilacqua is a known liar. I wouldn’t believe a word he says about anything, especially in this sex abuse scandal. Let us hope the conference of bishops displays more wisdom and decency than the American cardinals by voting in a zero-tolerance policy and a policy of reporting allegations of abuse to the authorities.

  We can only hope. CeCe — I do not feel obligated to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forego their use.         –Galileo Galilei

  Response:

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  

• It's surgery for me again!

  Question:

  Hi All, This is an update from my doctors visit today.  I will need surgery again to repair my diaphragm that is fraying from the previous surgery.  The difference this time is that I will need to be cut from the breast bone to my navel instead of this surgery being done laprascopically.  I’m very worried about this.  The surgeon did say that he would like me to lose 6kg (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful. I told the surgeon that I would prefer to lose without medication but will self perseverance. This op will take place in 6 weeks or sooner if the weight comes off.  So I will be here day in day out looking for support whilst I do it all over again.  So now my figures are going back up so that I can keep myself aware of how I am going. Here are the numbers  212lbs/198.8(mini goal in 6 weeks)/154 (dream goal) So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose

  hello rose! what dieting meal plan are you going to choose, for this weight loss project of yours? rosie reading and posting!

  Response:

  Hi Rosie, I am planning to use what worked for me before.  Low fat intake, fat counting and exercise!  When I told my friends today they said that they would come walking with me again and I will be joining the YMCA again and doing come Body Combat classes again. I’ve been looking at low carb but I have been such a carb queen, being Italian I don’t know if I can do without pasta or rice!!  But I am looking at options right now but am swayed to go back to what has worked before. Any ideas? — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose hello rose! what dieting meal plan are you going to choose, for this weight loss project of yours? rosie reading and posting!

  Response:

  by all means, find what works for you (  Low fat intake, fat counting and exercise!)and stick with it! — read and post, rosie "The best time to plant a tree… was twenty years ago.                   The second best time, is today."                  Chinese  Proverb

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Rosie, I am planning to use what worked for me before.  Low fat intake, fat counting and exercise!  When I told my friends today they said that they would come walking with me again and I will be joining the YMCA again and doing come Body Combat classes again. I’ve been looking at low carb but I have been such a carb queen, being Italian I don’t know if I can do without pasta or rice!!  But I am looking at options right now but am swayed to go back to what has worked before. Any ideas? — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse" So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose hello rose! what dieting meal plan are you going to choose, for this weight loss project of yours? rosie reading and posting!

  Response:

  I wish you the best, Rose.  I know these things are very tough to go thru. My prayers will be with you.  I’m sure you will do fine, and all will be over soon! — Hopefull (294/230/135)

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, This is an update from my doctors visit today.  I will need surgery again to repair my diaphragm that is fraying from the previous surgery.  The difference this time is that I will need to be cut from the breast bone to my navel instead of this surgery being done laprascopically.  I’m very worried about this.  The surgeon did say that he would like me to lose 6kg (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful. I told the surgeon that I would prefer to lose without medication but will self perseverance. This op will take place in 6 weeks or sooner if the weight comes off.  So I will be here day in day out looking for support whilst I do it all over again.  So now my figures are going back up so that I can keep myself aware of how I am going. Here are the numbers  212lbs/198.8(mini goal in 6 weeks)/154 (dream goal) So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  Gook luck Rose, hope your surgery goes well. Roxan

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, This is an update from my doctors visit today.  I will need surgery again to repair my diaphragm that is fraying from the previous surgery.  The difference this time is that I will need to be cut from the breast bone to my navel instead of this surgery being done laprascopically.  I’m very worried about this.  The surgeon did say that he would like me to lose 6kg (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful. I told the surgeon that I would prefer to lose without medication but will self perseverance. This op will take place in 6 weeks or sooner if the weight comes off.  So I will be here day in day out looking for support whilst I do it all over again.  So now my figures are going back up so that I can keep myself aware of how I am going. Here are the numbers  212lbs/198.8(mini goal in 6 weeks)/154 (dream goal) So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful.

  Rose, Sorry about the surgery; that’s a bummer. Reductil is known as Meridia in the US. The generic name is sibutramine. It is a serotonin and norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor (SNRI). These are two pathways in your brain that affect satiety. Here’s a plain language article from 1998 Diabetes Forecast that will give you the basics: http://www.diabetes.org/DiabetesForecast/98June/pg33.htm I also have a Meridia FAQ on my web site: http://www.obesity-news.com/merfaq.htm Recently Italy has suspended sales of Reductil and in the US the group Public Citizen has petitioned the US FDA to remove Meridia from the market. The controversy surrounds some adverse reactions and several patient deaths. However, the deaths are most likely not a consequence of taking sibutramine but are associated with obesity related comorbidities. An Italian doctor who participated in the sibutramine trials and also treated one of the two Italian women who died after taking sibutramine sent me descriptions of the two cases. Both deaths are unrelated to taking the drug. I have some press releases concerning this on the Meridia page on my web site: http://www.obesity-news.com/latenews.htm You will also find links to Abbott Labs Meridia web site on that page. All drugs, of course, have risks. The major risk associated with Reductil is elevated blood pressure. It occurs in around 5 percent of patients who take it, and so you should regularly monitor your BP while taking this drug. Best of luck with that surgery. I hope you fly right through! Barbara Barbara Hirsch, Publisher OBESITY MEDS AND RESEARCH NEWS The latest in obesity research and weight loss drug development http://www.obesity-news.com/

  Response:

  Thanks so much for your prayers Hopefull  I really appreciate it — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wish you the best, Rose.  I know these things are very tough to go thru. My prayers will be with you.  I’m sure you will do fine, and all will be over soon! — Hopefull (294/230/135) Hi All, This is an update from my doctors visit today.  I will need surgery again to repair my diaphragm that is fraying from the previous surgery.  The difference this time is that I will need to be cut from the breast bone to my navel instead of this surgery being done laprascopically.  I’m very worried about this.  The surgeon did say that he would like me to lose 6kg (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful. I told the surgeon that I would prefer to lose without medication but will self perseverance. This op will take place in 6 weeks or sooner if the weight comes off. So I will be here day in day out looking for support whilst I do it all over again.  So now my figures are going back up so that I can keep myself aware of how I am going. Here are the numbers  212lbs/198.8(mini goal in 6 weeks)/154 (dream goal) So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  Thanks Roxan — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Gook luck Rose, hope your surgery goes well. Roxan Hi All, This is an update from my doctors visit today.  I will need surgery again to repair my diaphragm that is fraying from the previous surgery.  The difference this time is that I will need to be cut from the breast bone to my navel instead of this surgery being done laprascopically.  I’m very worried about this.  The surgeon did say that he would like me to lose 6kg (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful. I told the surgeon that I would prefer to lose without medication but will self perseverance. This op will take place in 6 weeks or sooner if the weight comes off. So I will be here day in day out looking for support whilst I do it all over again.  So now my figures are going back up so that I can keep myself aware of how I am going. Here are the numbers  212lbs/198.8(mini goal in 6 weeks)/154 (dream goal) So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  Thanks for all the links Barbara.  I will have a thorough read before buying it.  My blood pressure is always low so I guess this is probably why he recommended it. I am making an appointment with my GP so I can have my blood pressure regularly checked and be weighed in. Thanks again for your information — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful. Rose, Sorry about the surgery; that’s a bummer. Reductil is known as Meridia in the US. The generic name is sibutramine. It is a serotonin and norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor (SNRI). These are two pathways in your brain that affect satiety. Here’s a plain language article from 1998 Diabetes Forecast that will give you the basics: http://www.diabetes.org/DiabetesForecast/98June/pg33.htm I also have a Meridia FAQ on my web site: http://www.obesity-news.com/merfaq.htm Recently Italy has suspended sales of Reductil and in the US the group Public Citizen has petitioned the US FDA to remove Meridia from the market. The controversy surrounds some adverse reactions and several patient deaths. However, the deaths are most likely not a consequence of taking sibutramine but are associated with obesity related comorbidities. An Italian doctor who participated in the sibutramine trials and also treated one of the two Italian women who died after taking sibutramine sent me descriptions of the two cases. Both deaths are unrelated to taking the drug. I have some press releases concerning this on the Meridia page on my web site: http://www.obesity-news.com/latenews.htm You will also find links to Abbott Labs Meridia web site on that page. All drugs, of course, have risks. The major risk associated with Reductil is elevated blood pressure. It occurs in around 5 percent of patients who take it, and so you should regularly monitor your BP while taking this drug. Best of luck with that surgery. I hope you fly right through! Barbara Barbara Hirsch, Publisher OBESITY MEDS AND RESEARCH NEWS The latest in obesity research and weight loss drug development http://www.obesity-news.com/

  Response:

  Thanks Gloria.  I know it sounds so scary for me right now.  Just knowing that they are correcting something that went wrong the first time.  I hope they get it right this time. I will keep you posted. — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Rose, glad you find the help here!! I am going to watch for you and I’ll pray! Please know I understand because whenI was 32 yrs old I had hysterectomy (partial) and back to hospital after only 6 weeks for removel of the rest. It was the pits! Not fun! (((HUGS))) glo

  Response:

  Rose, glad you find the help here!! I am going to watch for you and I’ll pray! Please know I understand because whenI was 32 yrs old I had hysterectomy (partial) and back to hospital after only 6 weeks for removel of the rest. It was the pits! Not fun! (((HUGS))) glo

  Response:

  Rose, glad you find the help here!! I am going to watch for you and I’ll pray! Please know I understand because whenI was 32 yrs old I had hysterectomy (partial) and back to hospital after only 6 weeks for removel of the rest. It was the pits! Not fun!

  If you’re from the US, doctors don’t generally do partial hysterectomies, which involves removing the top of the uterus but leaving the bottom  (the cervix) intact. The cervix is the opening to the uterus which can be felt from the vagina. When women are younger, however, doctors will generally perform a hysterectomy only, instead of a hysterectomy and oophorectomy. An oophorectomy is removal of the ovaries. When I was 41 I had a hysterectomy, ovaries were left in since they weren’t diseased. Since an attempt at vaginally assisted laparoscopy failed (fibroids were too big), I was given a small incision, spent two days in the hospital, and went back to work part-time six days later. I began walking a mile a day about 4 days after the surgery and built up from there. The only activity I had to refrain from for any extended period of time was strength training. But I started that again after 4 weeks. Rose, this is the way that most surgery goes, and horror stories are the exception rather than the rule. Further, I wonder about people who tell horror stories to people getting ready to go under the knife. Rose, if you were diligent in picking your surgeon, I’m sure the odds for an uncomplicated recovery are in your favor! Good luck, and let us know how you do. Barbara Barbara Hirsch, Publisher OBESITY MEDS AND RESEARCH NEWS The latest in obesity research and weight loss drug development http://www.obesity-news.com/

  Response:

  I will be sure and say a prayer that all works well for you.           (.)  (.) —o00—-(_)—-00o—             mo Hi All,

       This is an update from my doctors visit today.  I will need surgery again to repair my diaphragm that is fraying from the previous surgery.  The difference this time is that I will need to be cut from the breast bone to my navel instead of this surgery being done laprascopically.  I’m very worried about this.  The surgeon did say that he would like me to lose 6kg (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful.      I told the surgeon that I would prefer to lose without medication but will self perseverance.      This op will take place in 6 weeks or sooner if the weight comes off.  So I will be here day in day out looking for support whilst I do it all over again.  So now my figures are going back up so that I can keep myself aware of how I am going.      Here are the numbers  212lbs/198.8(mini goal in 6 weeks)/154 (dream goal)      So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less.      Thanks for your support Rose <<

  Response:

  Thanks Barbara. Let me tell you its the horror stories I have heard the most..lol.. but yes I researched the surgeon for a year before  I allowed him to do it the first time.  I knew that he had a 2% failure rate, but hey is anyone perfect. He is the best in his field and he is a wonderful surgeon with a wonderful bed side manner.  He made me feel comfortable with having the procedure done, however,  I am still a little scared.  But I just have to trust that all will go well. Thanks so very much for your kind post. — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Rose, glad you find the help here!! I am going to watch for you and I’ll pray! Please know I understand because whenI was 32 yrs old I had hysterectomy (partial) and back to hospital after only 6 weeks for removel of the rest. It was the pits! Not fun! If you’re from the US, doctors don’t generally do partial hysterectomies, which involves removing the top of the uterus but leaving the bottom  (the cervix) intact. The cervix is the opening to the uterus which can be felt from the vagina. When women are younger, however, doctors will generally perform a hysterectomy only, instead of a hysterectomy and oophorectomy. An oophorectomy is removal of the ovaries. When I was 41 I had a hysterectomy, ovaries were left in since they weren’t diseased. Since an attempt at vaginally assisted laparoscopy failed (fibroids were too big), I was given a small incision, spent two days in the hospital, and went back to work part-time six days later. I began walking a mile a day about 4 days after the surgery and built up from there. The only activity I had to refrain from for any extended period of time was strength training. But I started that again after 4 weeks. Rose, this is the way that most surgery goes, and horror stories are the exception rather than the rule. Further, I wonder about people who tell horror stories to people getting ready to go under the knife. Rose, if you were diligent in picking your surgeon, I’m sure the odds for an uncomplicated recovery are in your favor! Good luck, and let us know how you do. Barbara Barbara Hirsch, Publisher OBESITY MEDS AND RESEARCH NEWS The latest in obesity research and weight loss drug development http://www.obesity-news.com/

  Response:

  Sorry to hear about the needed surgery.  Good luck with the weight loss. Beverly

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, This is an update from my doctors visit today.  I will need surgery again to repair my diaphragm that is fraying from the previous surgery.  The difference this time is that I will need to be cut from the breast bone to my navel instead of this surgery being done laprascopically.  I’m very worried about this.  The surgeon did say that he would like me to lose 6kg (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful. I told the surgeon that I would prefer to lose without medication but will self perseverance. This op will take place in 6 weeks or sooner if the weight comes off.  So I will be here day in day out looking for support whilst I do it all over again.  So now my figures are going back up so that I can keep myself aware of how I am going. Here are the numbers  212lbs/198.8(mini goal in 6 weeks)/154 (dream goal) So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  Thanks Beverly — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sorry to hear about the needed surgery.  Good luck with the weight loss. Beverly Hi All, This is an update from my doctors visit today.  I will need surgery again to repair my diaphragm that is fraying from the previous surgery.  The difference this time is that I will need to be cut from the breast bone to my navel instead of this surgery being done laprascopically.  I’m very worried about this.  The surgeon did say that he would like me to lose 6kg (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful. I told the surgeon that I would prefer to lose without medication but will self perseverance. This op will take place in 6 weeks or sooner if the weight comes off. So I will be here day in day out looking for support whilst I do it all over again.  So now my figures are going back up so that I can keep myself aware of how I am going. Here are the numbers  212lbs/198.8(mini goal in 6 weeks)/154 (dream goal) So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less. Thanks for your support — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  Response:

  Thanks so very much for your prayers bandannamo ) — Rose I pray for our Future – Children with Strong, Healthy Minds, Bodies and Future. "Stop Child Abuse"

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I will be sure and say a prayer that all works well for you.           (.)  (.) —o00—-(_)—-00o—             mo Hi All,      This is an update from my doctors visit today.  I will need surgery again to repair my diaphragm that is fraying from the previous surgery.  The difference this time is that I will need to be cut from the breast bone to my navel instead of this surgery being done laprascopically.  I’m very worried about this.  The surgeon did say that he would like me to lose 6kg (13.2lbs) in the next 6 weeks before the op.  He has written a script for Reductil.  I don’t know anything about this tablet except for my surgeon passing me the script and telling me that this will help.  So I will be doing a little research before I fill the script.  If anyone here can shed some light, I will be grateful.      I told the surgeon that I would prefer to lose without medication but will self perseverance.      This op will take place in 6 weeks or sooner if the weight comes off. So I will be here day in day out looking for support whilst I do it all over again.  So now my figures are going back up so that I can keep myself aware of how I am going.      Here are the numbers  212lbs/198.8(mini goal in 6 weeks)/154 (dream goal)      So I’ll be here, reading and posting and possibly ranting a little here and there, but here never the less.      Thanks for your support Rose <<

  Response:

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  

• Bad stuff coming

  Question:

  Hey Liz. I don’t think I am any smarter then dad, he can understand anything I got going.  People who have had NDEs just tack their sails into the wind different then other people, and NDEs dont fix up dsyfunctional dynamics in the personality. I am healthier then dad, he dont have much recovery though he has done some work with therapists, mindtalk of course.  So he is a bit pissed, his emotional avoidance keeps him from seeing into the problem, Dad just looks at me, and looks at the problem and comes up with this stuff from the eye of a preditator or an preditator onlooker.  A komodo dragon is not upset at another konodo’s eating habbits ya know, so Dad and Bush get along well. Dad is not an Andrea Yates, us kids are still alive … Dad just lives down that street Andrea lives on with that suicide homicide stuff.  Kids are not born or go though a growth stage that puts them in to a place of hate and fear and greed and lies. As for jail, if Bush has to kill more Americans until Americans find out that is not the way to fight the Drug War … Bush will shoot a 3 year old baby in the back while sucking at mother’s breast for the Drug War. I gotta volunteer.  Give him a body to get kinky on, do bondage on, torture and kill from abusive attention or depraved neglect. There are videotapes in jail now and they usually show the criminal conduct of the jailers. No hospice training for them in their education for this $70,000 a year job. Teachers and nurses and airline pilots get less. Besides, they would hunt me down and find me like they found Ken Hayes in Canada. They dont want to find Ben Laudin. It would stop the war. stop Bushit’s Phoney war. sumbuddie on da watchtower :*/ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dad sent me a reply, he thinks its way ok for me to go to jail for medical marijuana. He has two divorces and is gun happy. sumbuddie said dis :*( Hi   You made your bed now you have to lie in it.  Tough world isn’t it even if  you reject it. Don’t worry about jail. They don’t want you there either .  Amazing how you can deny everything. Ah.  Your dad is a jerk, too, huh?  You know, based on that very brief bit from him above, I have to wonder if part of his problem with you is how much smarter you obviously are than he?  Like, my parents were jealous of my smarts, too, you know what I mean? In any case, is jail an imminent threat?  If so, and you want a place to hide, well, you can always come visit people in this end of the state, can’t you?  I mean, how are any of us out here to know what may or may not be going on with you and the cops, right?  You can conceivably hide out…um, vist us out here, couldn’t you?  In fact, in a couple weeks, I’m going to be gone for a week.  The whole family is going on vacation (ironically, up north) and you are welcome to housesit if you need a place, Alan.

  —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

  Response:

  Alan, Somehow you are on my mind, and I’m new here so I don’t quite know the whole picture but if I may be so bold as to put in my two cents here? We don’t choose to whom we are born, only what we do with ourselves once we are freed from the bonds which hold us to certain people. I’m just saying that the merit of who you are as a person is very apparent, to me at least, and I think you are something incredible. Even though I suffered something terrible at the hands of my Mother there will always be a part of me that needs/wants her love and for her to accept me.  The hardest thing to do is to not destroy myself when those wishes don’t come true. I’m clean – counting five years now, but being clean means responsibility for me, not for my parents.  Bearing this thought in mind is the only thing that gets me through some days. Hang in the Alan. Blessings, Kiana – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, for you guys listening in. Dad sent me a reply, he thinks its way ok for me to go to jail for medical marijuana. He has two divorces and is gun happy. sumbuddie said dis :*( Hi   You made your bed now you have to lie in it.  Tough world isn’t it even if  you reject it. Don’t worry about jail. They don’t want you there either .  Amazing how you can deny everything. i kind of figured you go that way dad. after all you did marry someone as sick as mom (hey I got my track record as well) have a good life, i am going to die out here without you around like you tossed your own brother to the gutter. that is some kind of love you got going in this family you made. would have been better for you to shoot me at age 8 like you wanted to around the divorce and do a Andrea Yeats on me and the siblings. I am in denial and you are what we all know is healthy and sane. you have a wonderful family life that just reeks of it. ur son alan —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

  Response:

  So, for you guys listening in.

  Heya, Alan… Dad sent me a reply, he thinks its way ok for me to go to jail for medical marijuana. He has two divorces and is gun happy. sumbuddie said dis :*( Hi   You made your bed now you have to lie in it.  Tough world isn’t it even if  you reject it. Don’t worry about jail. They don’t want you there either .  Amazing how you can deny everything.

  Ah.  Your dad is a jerk, too, huh?  You know, based on that very brief bit from him above, I have to wonder if part of his problem with you is how much smarter you obviously are than he?  Like, my parents were jealous of my smarts, too, you know what I mean? In any case, is jail an imminent threat?  If so, and you want a place to hide, well, you can always come visit people in this end of the state, can’t you?  I mean, how are any of us out here to know what may or may not be going on with you and the cops, right?  You can conceivably hide out…um, vist us out here, couldn’t you?  In fact, in a couple weeks, I’m going to be gone for a week.  The whole family is going on vacation (ironically, up north) and you are welcome to housesit if you need a place, Alan. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i kind of figured you go that way dad. after all you did marry someone as sick as mom (hey I got my track record as well) have a good life, i am going to die out here without you around like you tossed your own brother to the gutter. that is some kind of love you got going in this family you made. would have been better for you to shoot me at age 8 like you wanted to around the divorce and do a Andrea Yeats on me and the siblings. I am in denial and you are what we all know is healthy and sane. you have a wonderful family life that just reeks of it. ur son alan —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

  Response:

  I know exactly what you mean, Alan I have found more love and acceptance from friends than I ever had from my own father. But, at least we have good people in our lives now. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – :*( I’m sorry, Alan thanks mica, my neighbors, my cub scout pack, my high school buddies, my recovery buddies, they have been more sane and more loving to me then my own family. I am so thankfull for my public education teachers and the school nurse. sumbuddie loves ya :*) —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

  Response:

  makes my eyes wet sweetie to read this. thanks for your love. sumbuddie back atcha :*) Windy – who would miss Alan’s voice if he went to jail – even when she disagrees with him, she sees him as a very worthy voice here.

  —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

  Response:

  :*( I’m sorry, Alan

  thanks mica, my neighbors, my cub scout pack, my high school buddies, my recovery buddies, they have been more sane and more loving to me then my own family. I am so thankfull for my public education teachers and the school nurse. sumbuddie loves ya :*) —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

  Response:

  So, for you guys listening in. Dad sent me a reply, he thinks its way ok for me to go to jail for medical marijuana. He has two divorces and is gun happy. sumbuddie said dis :*(

  I’m sorry, Alan

  Response:

  yeah me to I am sorry I understood this post of yours very well

  – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, for you guys listening in. Dad sent me a reply, he thinks its way ok for me to go to jail for medical marijuana. He has two divorces and is gun happy. sumbuddie said dis :*( I’m sorry, Alan

  Response:

  I am just so thankfull for my recovery joey. I can understand how hurt he is to do this kind of stuff, on a par with his brainwashing. His own mom died at age 5, his dad was an alcoholic, and he got hit by him at a young age that broke his jaw for three months. Dad gave me a better childhood then the one he had thats for sure.  He’s a WW2 and Korea vet. His father, born in 1890 or so, a grandchild of Abe Lincoln generation had a lot of child abuse back then  So that has gotten better some but we got more work to do to stop child abuse. Now America and the world can see why there is such generational and social illness in this country. Bush is a uniter not a divider. Sending medical patients into jail for self treatment of canabis is just the thing to get his children to stop abusing drugs and alcohol. The Bush kids took marijuana long before they took alcohol or percodans. Its the GATEWAY DRUG. sure they did. But Bush found Jesus and that is how he gave up Cocaine. His kids just have to find Jesus as well. That is why they are in rehab … of course. Me, will Bush try to get me to find Jesus to release me from the Evil Spirit of Cancer, like he has been released from the Evil Spirit. Global Warming is a bunch of hooie. Bush spends $500 Billion a year pulling ditch weed pot that was planted during WW2 for the war effort. We could use $500 Billion right now, and stoping the war on marijuana would very quickly change the economics to the betterment for America by bringing in new industry that is in Europe, Canada and Mexico already. Hey I just had an idea, I have to bring a NAFTA suit against the USA for loss of trade for making hemp products outlawed, just like Canada is making Billions on the MTBE pollution problem we got now. sumbuddie who cares :*) yeah me to I am sorry I understood this post of yours very well

  —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

  Response:

  So, for you guys listening in. Dad sent me a reply, he thinks its way ok for me to go to jail for medical marijuana. He has two divorces and is gun happy. sumbuddie said dis :*( Hi   You made your bed now you have to lie in it.  Tough world isn’t it even if  you reject it. Don’t worry about jail. They don’t want you there either .  Amazing how you can deny everything. i kind of figured you go that way dad. after all you did marry someone as sick as mom (hey I got my track record as well) have a good life, i am going to die out here without you around like you tossed your own brother to the gutter. that is some kind of love you got going in this family you made. would have been better for you to shoot me at age 8 like you wanted to around the divorce and do a Andrea Yeats on me and the siblings. I am in denial and you are what we all know is healthy and sane. you have a wonderful family life that just reeks of it. ur son alan —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

  Response:

  No comments Child Abuse Recovery
  
  
• « Older Entries